Tuesday, March 29, 2011

Trying to Improve

Our metals really hung in well today. They both looked terrible again this morning and, frankly, I was worried that we might get a bit of a "buyers strike" and see things fall. I'm happy to report that we avoided this fate.

Before we get to the charts of interest, a little follow up on last night's post. Lots of interesting discussion regarding this article. If you haven't read it yet, I suggest you do it now:
Much of the discussion centered upon which central banks might actually have silver to lease. Luckily, the article's author is a closet Turdite and he contacted me this morning with some clarification. Below is a c&p of his comments. I hope this helps clear up some of the confusion.

Mr. Turd,

Thanks for posting my article this morning on silver and leasing.  I actually read your blog on a regular basis since I do very little TA and mostly fundamentals.  Your info certainly helps get the complete picture.

I think there is some confusion about who is doing the leasing.  I referenced "central banks" in the article but did not mean that term to be exclusive.  For gold leasing, central banks are the primary culprit, but for silver it is most likely to be what I called "bullion banks", including the "caretaker" custodian of SLV itself.  Rather than interchange the term I kept using "central bank" for what I thought would be easier to understand.  Some of your commenters rightfully pointed out the inconsistency. 

In any event, thanks again for the posting. Keep up the good work. I enjoy reading your thoughts. Jeff

OK, back to business. As we discussed earlier, the breakout in oil helped rescue the metals today. Around 11:00, oil sagged and took the metals with it. But then, when all seemed lost, it reversed again and actually stands now at $104.71/bbl, just 29 cents off its high of the day. Predictably, the metals are firming up, too.

Where crude trades from here will obviously impact the next 65 hours in the metals. Fortunately, the crude chart now looks friendly and a move toward $105.75 seems likely. That extra dollar in crude should help silver move toward 37.50 and provide the impetus for about $10 in gold, too.
Because of the current coupling of crude and gold, I've added a crude widget to the upper right of the blog. It updates every 10 minutes so it provides a reasonable snapshot for our purposes here.

Lastly, here's a followup from Patrick Heller on the various ways to purchase gold and silver. Some may find it helpful.

More later. Keep an eye on crude! TF

p.s. If you really want to have a few laughs, read this:
and then read this:


  1. REPOSTED due to new thread!

    California Lawyer: I agree with you on the seamless integration of plastic into our economic fabric. I was very surprised when I first heard of SNAP (less than a year ago) and thought it was a good thing for those on food stamps because it removes some of the stigma from purchasing in public. Then I realized it is quite an effective ruse to hide the very LARGE numbers of people who are now forced to be slaves to the Government tit (many through no fault of their own). There just aren't a lot of meaningful jobs. I know. I've been searching for 2 years now. I'm not on welfare though... unless you include my meager Navy retirement.

    Go to a Wallmart around midnight on the night the cards are "refilled" and you'll see what I mean.

    I was also raised on paranoia courtesy of the LDS (We're in the Latter Days children!) and grew up dreading the apocalypse but at least they are right about food storage in my opinion. But the church was always more of a social than a spiritual thing for me, I found God more often in the mountains than in a building.

    If I put my tin-foil hat on I can see even plastic being replaced by an RFID implant or the mark of the beast being something like a QR code tattoo.

    Those waiting for the rapture and thinking they will be whisked away to a land of rainbows and gumdrops are going to be disappointed I believe.

    Gold, Guns and Grub will save yer ass!

  2. Third...?

    (w verification....mines!)

  3. So how much of today's action can be attributed to "Happy Tuesday"? If so, tomorrow's action will surely be more of a show of intentions by EE.

  4. CEF is buying; so can they find the physical and are they BTFD?????


  5. @miles

    If they haven't changed their prospectus in the last few years, that means a drop back to zero on the premium over NAV since never before did they let a new filing dilute their shares.


  6. I was just going to post about the CEF notice!

    I've read about good and bad times to buy into CEF...one good time, of course, is when the premium is at, near or below 0.
    Somewhere, my foggy brains remembers warnings about offerings and dilution of the price and there was a big debate about whether dilution actually does occur.

    Time for a refresher on this...can someone explain the ramifications of such an offering????


  7. Curmudgeony Dissembler--my post obviously crossed...

    So, no dilution, but a drop to 0 premium..

    So, is this the perfect time to buy, when this offering is made??


  8. @insightanalytical

    I read the announcement which says, "Central Fund will only proceed with the offering if it is non-dilutive to the net asset value of the Class A Shares owned by the existing Shareholders of Central Fund."

    It was always my experience with CEF (as well as GTU and SZVRF) that the premium went to zero when a new offering was made. I think that it will be no different this time.

    They are very nice people and list their phone number, you might want to call them up tomorrow. I'll probably sell my SVRZF and buy CEF and wait until SVRZF has another offering and if I still want to be heavy silver, will buy back into that at a much lower premium.

    Call them, though, to make sure I'm correct.

    Good Luck,


  9. @insightanalytical.
    When CEf does an offering it is between the NAV and premium. right now the premium is around 8% so maybe the offering will be around a 5% premium. It does not dilute the shares in terms of NAV since they sell the shares at a premium to NAV but it will cause a drop in the premium which usually recovers but not always. It is considered accretive to existing shareholders as it decreases the funds' management costs per share. It is also beneficial in that it creates immediate demand for physical gold and silver. Usually it's a good time to buy when they do an offering. In the long run PM investors should welcome these offerings due to the physical demand they create.
    we should all hope that these closed end funds continue to do these secondary offerings Sprott's included
    good luck

  10. Billary thinks that it is OK for teh U.S. to arm the Libyan rebels

    NATO disagrees

  11. Kiyotei:

    No disrespect to your service. I am a former Army solidier myself.

    My point was that the populace in general is being desensitized to the absence of tangible money.

    More importantly, if you think of it from TPTB perspective, are you afraid of retirees or of the very lowest rung of society?

    If those at the lower rung are hungry, there will be swift and furious anarchy. If the retirees protest, what are they really going to do? The retirees will cut back, make do. They always have, and always will. They are useful to TPTB solely as a means to reelect those very same politicians who will maintain the status quo.

    The lowest rung will not cut back, nor make do. They will riot. They are thus, squarely in the focus of TPTB, and will remain there.

    I was there in April 1992 when LA burst into flames over the Rodney King verdict. It was swift, furious, and went on for many days. It only stopped when the National Guard went in with automatic weapons.

    Thus, the lowest rung will be fed, and placated. However, the rest of us who know better, will have already prepared for all of this. Of course this presupposes a healthy supply of clean water, food, guns and ammunition, and the mental wherewithal to take action to protect one's family and self.

    On that, I agree with you totally.

  12. Re: Link other ways to buy....

    I'm going with Goldmoney for an alternative to buying online and saving myself the shipping costs, which for international is crazy, then add in tax at 20%, then post office charge for handling $12 :-(

    I reckon some of it is already being stealth confiscated here!! Goldmoney can keep it where I want, I buy at spot, pay premium and am sell instantly if I need to. Bring it on.

  13. About Japan; go to this video, "Son of a gun," listen to the Japanese announcer, and substitute the words "son of a bitch" for that, in exactly that tone of voice in regards to corium.



  14. @deaddog

    following up from yesterday's thread re: golddealer.ca...have you tried to get Richard on the phone? If you were able to get him, what was his reason for the delay?

  15. CalLaw:
    No disrespect taken hahaha. My entire family has been Army for several generations - Dad, Grandpa, uncles etc... so I'm quite used to being called squid or swabbie. :-)

    I live in Socal (Temecula) and I remember the riots well.

    I was just remarking to my wife the other day how I found it unusual that there were no major protests here over our insane foreign campaigns like there was in the 60s/70s when I grew up. She remarked rather sagely that the difference was "the draft." I think she is right and being a Gen-Xer herself I think she has the insight I lack.

    How long do you think TPTB can extend and pretend we can police the entire world before they MUST bring back a draft?

    I KNOW our unfortunate troops are tired of doing these long deployments.

    I remember the saying well:
    “We, the unwilling, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have done so much, for so long, with so little, we are now qualified to do anything with nothing.”

  16. Visit your local coin club and their coin show.
    You can trade between FRN's and coins anonymously with minimal (if you are paying attention) bid/ask differential. Perhaps this is the seed of the non-plastic market of the post-Keynesian future?

  17. Kiyotei:

    How long can we go without a draft in the USA? Great question.

    Simple answer.

    In the down turn at the end of the 70's early 80's, the economic climate was so bad, that the US Army was turning away many people since the Army had plenty of recruits. The people that wanted to join the service were DESPERATE. I joined up in 1983. I went to Army basic training with people mostly from the midwest, who had literally no chance for economic advancement short of the military.

    Same thing now. The disaffected young men and women will beg to be accepted into the armed forces. No draft is necessary. The big question is reenlistment, so watch the reenlistment bonuses get really big.

  18. Turd,
    not finding any laughable in those stories about Japan - what am I missing?

  19. Can you guys help me out here? I'm trying to wrap my brain around something. It seems to me we have maybe 3 different types of silver:

    1. REAL SILVER (physical silver and/or the paper that truly owns it)
    2. PAPER SILVER (crap that is supposed to represent real silver but that has been allocated multiple times)
    3. PAPER PAPER SILVER (really crappy crap - your typical JPM short sale)

    I suppose 2 and 3 amount to the same thing, but I'm not sure.

    Also, do we have any reliable idea what the ratios of these three types of silver are? For example I have heard JPM has sold the entire silver market short by over 20%. What does this mean exactly?


  20. Wow, nice articles and charts!

    The thing is, is this crude break out legit? I'm watching. Thanks again =)

  21. Turdle GG

    The laugh is this statement in particular the last part:

    Fukushima meltdown fears rise after radioactive core melts through vessel – but 'no danger of Chernobyl-style catastrophe'

    It is already worse then Chernobyl or will be and simply has not been admitted. The standard rule is always lie to the people.

  22. Turdle, c'mon. You've been around here long enough to recognize my desperate sarcasm...

  23. Nice AH bounce, thanks Asia & Ozz.

    I was away for awhile and wasn't sure what to do with my holdings. So last week I sold Apr 47 Calls in SLW, Apr 10 Exk and APR 55 FCX. So far, so good but I do NOT want to get called out (especially SLW) but felt I needed to do something as we seem to be a bit range bound now and want to generate some cash. I've had good success selling near term, slightly OTM CCs for sometime now, but have been in situations where I get called out and end up chasing something that makes a big move only to fall back later. Currently, I find myself hoping things go up but not too much too fast. Feel like I've created my own little wall of worry.

    Been catching up on all the threads and comments of the last week, and must say, Wow! So much info,,, like drinking out of a fire hose. Anyway, hope everyone is doing well with their trades.

  24. eric#1,

    Crazy low volume in BPM.V today. If Yahoo is accurate, only one lot of 825 shares traded and it dropped the price over 5%.

    Talk about a closely held stock!

  25. I looked up the word " Amazing " in the Dictionary.

    Dictionary results: " The Stock Market "

  26. You said you added a crude widget at the top, so I raced up there looking for a stripper. Was disappointed!

  27. Turd, OK I'm with you now.

    Having lived in Japan for a long time, I can say that this tragedy is showing up all the worst aspects of Japan's way of dealing with things. Simply speaking, their culture cannot deal with unexpected change, because they rely on having set ways to do everything.

    If by chance anyone wants to learn about this, I'd recommend "Behind the Japanese Bow", by Boyde De Mente.
    Also, "Dogs and Demons", by Alex Kerr

  28. CalLaw: I like simple answers (K.I.S.S. principle is golden).

    I concur with your assessment. I joined in 1979 after Carter let the economy fall apart. Reagan gave me my only decent pay raise and let things slide after that.

    And yes I do remember the desperation. I was a wanna be hippie who was recruited right off a bus stop by a fast talking bear of a man.

    The days of bread and circuses are upon us. Very eerie parallel to the last great empire. Modern Romans are we. Nothing to see here... move along folks. I wonder if I can find employment in the FEMA ReEducation camps?

    Silver and gold (AKA real money) will go to the moon in the long run I'm sure but I have a nagging feeling we are about to see a BIG correction real soon.

    I am neutral to the drop and will gladly load up the wheel barrel if it happens but I think silver is so volatile right now it could go to $50 one day and a week later be at $27.

  29. If everyone wants to learn about stock manipulation then listen to this podcast SilverRunNW suggested earlier, it is extremely interesting and a real eye opener to what we are up against. Scroll to the 3:30 mark to after you start it.

    OVERSTOCKED / How Naked Short-Selling and Counterfeiting Stocks Create Cascading Economic Failures / an Interview with Dr. Patrick Byrne, CEO of Overstock dot com


  30. CA Lawyer... your comment on the lower rungs of civilization being or getting desperate is a scary thought that seems very likely (it's a given actually) when things start getting tougher.

    Consider this scenario that happens every year in our supposedly good times over the last decade or so....People lined up at a Walmart or wherever on Black Friday for Christmas shopping getting totally unruly and primitive just to be in the door first. And then someone has the audacity to get pushed or falls down to the ground and people (with money or plastic in their pockets and supposedly in a X-mas mood) trample or start fights at the door or inside trying to get the last big sale item or whatever.
    Some people get crude and ugly and desperate for everyday simple things in the best of times. People actually get shot or trampled Xmas shopping. WTF is up with that?!?!?
    Can you imagine what it will get like when food stamps or utility help or any assistance is taken away and taxes and inflation takes hold??? OMG!
    We ain't seen nothing yet! People prey on each other now as it is(depending where you live, maybe alot more).
    Your personal security, food and gas is where it will be at if things implode. I can easily see looting and riots happening and it doesn't seem to take much for it to start.
    Most of the populace has a better clue who is winning American Idol or Dancing with the Stars or Apprentice etc. then realize the "true" situation that has been building for years. If all hell breaks loose I hope TPTB have the sense to leave people's cell phones , internet and cable TV available. Sounds silly and unimportant I know, but some of the softer things that the general public relies on for daily stress relief (gadgets and TV) will put them over the edge if they have idol hands and time on their hands and their TV or gadget time is taken away.

    I've maintained for a long time that there is a very fine line between chaos and order in society. The public trust and confidence is now completely broken with those of us in the know about the real financial situation our Govt. is in.
    The other disinterested, selfish lower rung will get primitive in a blink and make a Walmart Xmas line look like a family reunion in comparison.
    Can anyone imagine what it would have been like here in the U.S. if the same exact circumstances happened here instead of Japan?
    Civilzed man is one of the biggest oxymorons going. Looting and riots would have happened quickly. Some people need little excuse.
    I know just by reading these posts here and elsewhere that most of you are educated, highly focused and engaged in unselfish reality with a bias towards helping others cope or get ahead in our PM investing.
    Think about Walmart at Xmas and the videos and stories we have seen when those doors opened up. Not a pretty picture and there are lots of angry, selfish, uneducated citizens out there who not only expect freebies and Govt. help but they actually demand it like a birth right. Austerity or budgeting would be like a foreign language or an attack on their daily existence.
    Get ready for a Walmart Xmas on a daily basis at some point is what I'm expecting when TSHTF.
    Hate writing that but it seems likely if the overall trend in society and Govt. continue.

    Oh boy, can't wait for the Gov't. to shut down in a few days. (sarcasm totally on)

    When we all start to feel like a Walmart greeter on Xmas day you'll know were in the thick of it.
    I definitely feel the need to arm myself at some point soon just in case and I never really would have thought like that even a few years ago. Seems like a no brainer now and long past due at this point.

  31. Turdle gg.
    We understand your sensitivity to Japanese issues.
    It was and is an unimaginable tragedy,trully horrific.
    Not the first one and sure hope there will be no other.
    I guess the Japanese are not culturally connected to precious metals and the strong yen was their "gold".
    I guess as time passes this nation and its people will buy more and more pm and hopefully adopt Chinas attitude of strong pm aquisition.

  32. Evening Turds, Can anyone recomed a stock or ETF in the packaging and aluminium (mfg not production).

    Thank you kindly

  33. Guy,

    Reading Patrick Bryne's story was the first time I was introduced to the corruption and market manipulation that is so common today. The website for his story is www.deepcapture.com I believe. To those who haven't read about it, if this story is accurate, it exposes a "cartel" of influential people in the media and government, who coordinate together to take down companies of their choosing. I would suggest reading the story for those of you interested in "conspiracies" about our "markets." I'm looking forward to listening to that after work...

    If I recall correctly, some of the same scams used against Overstock.com are being used in the silver market...false regulations, naked shorts, disinformation, you know, the basics...

  34. I sent that article from minyanville to Ted Butler and Ted said it made no sense to him.
    Just passing it along.

  35. From Harvey,
    The comex folk notified us that a monstrous 290 contracts were served upon our longs for a total of 1,450,000 oz. The first big notice occurred during the first few days of March and it came from the customer loaning a huge number of oz of silver to the dealer.
    I did not see any evidence of this happening. As a matter of fact, I cannot see how this huge quantity got into the dealer in the first place. If you go back to all my commentaries, very little silver has been received by the dealer.
    So this is a big mystery. Maybe secretly we are seeing paper silver confirming the contracts. Who knows, we have no transparency at the comex.
    I will comment on the World Gold Council submission to the CFTC where they are asking for a change in the definition of deliverable supply and also they are demanding some sort of paper settlement.

    8,535,000 oz (served) + 200,000 (oz to be served) = 8,735,000 oz.
    we lost 120,000 oz from yesterday due to cash settlements.

    I've heard you can't eat it, but apparently, you can shit it...

  36. DarkPurpleHaze...Why do you assume uneducated people will be the selfish ones? A degree will not prevent one from getting hungry when grocery store shelves are empty.

  37. My gut is telling me oil will trend higher very slowly the remainder of the week.
    Two reasons....Syria dismissed their Govt supposedly. Assad is the Govt., who are they kidding? A perfect excuse for martial law or emergency powers etc. to fortify their hold. It's about to get worse there. (Iran must be scheming something up in Lebanon, Gaza or Bahrain to stir the pot further)
    Also, Saudi Arabia just came out with some edict or order that any protests or words of any negative type will be considered a crime or sin against Islam itself. Really?
    They are printing notices to distribute to their citizens as we speak. Seems like they just ramped it up to another level against their citizens.
    I don't see alot of positive events resulting from those two things or a U.S. Govt. shutdown occuring at the same time. Watch the USD (POSX/ lol!) closely as the shut down approaches and the oil reaction from it thereafter.
    Thats what my gut feels.

  38. Chinese rating agency sees no end to QE:


  39. "CNBC is a 24x7 hedge fund commercial" ~ Patrick Bryne


  40. Marcel

    Yes, that goofy stock goes up or down a nickel or dime at a time on zilch for volume. Drives me crazy.

  41. Regarding CEF doing an offering:

    I thought I was so clever buying GTU last year after their offering. Bought at nil for a premium and thought it would be a slam dunk winner to wait for it to go back around an 8% premium. STill waiting......

  42. george,
    thanks for that. Strangely, Japanese have pretty much lost their cultural affinity for gold, which is in stark contrast to the Chinese, Indians, Russians, etc.

    There is one thing, however, of which you can be truly certain: due to Japan's US-protectorate status, there will never be a China-style government-led campaign for the masses to buy gold.

  43. CFTC Position Limit Comments

    If you want to read the public comments on the CFTC position limits proposal, you can find them here: Link to CFTC Comments on Position Limits

    The site has a good "advanced search" tool. Funny, didn't find very many submissions by our elected officials, but there were a few.

  44. Marcel

    It gets even weirder than that. I just checked on the pink sheets quote for BPMSF. Apparently no trades at all since last Thursday.

    I guess closely held would be one way to put it. I'm thinking more like bizarroworld.

  45. sierra_hbpt,

    That article from Minyanville this am confused me too. The terms leasing and forward sale were used interchangeably. Other writing on the topic that I have read makes a distinction between the two types of transacton.

    It would make sense that they are not interchabgeable, as in a lease, the gold holder bears he risk that their PM is not returned to them, and in a forward sale, the buyer or cash holder bears th risk that PM is not delivered on the specified date and they find themselves out the cash they paid. My understanding also is that the forward sales market is for delivery at a future date greater than one year. Also, the discount rate applied to a specific transaction is a function of the length of time specified for delivery to occur, as you expect due to the time value of money.


  46. Ferdinand - thanks for the cheering words - I am down today but the sense behind DarkPurple's musings cannot be denied. Civilization is a thin veneer at the best of times and we live in complex societies that rely on complex systems. If/when government fails and the power doesn't work and the water systems fail there might well be chaos. Maybe the average citizen will be able to keep it all running when our elite run as they fail (I am thinking for example of our useless mid-level bureaucracy) but even a garbage or bus strike can paralyze a city - heck a snow storm was almost too much for New York! But I am not in a panic - just think we need to be able to discuss bad stuff honestly.

  47. Back to Harvey's comments today....I'm tired of waiting for "the COMEX default". The five separate bears videos. Wynter Benton. Claims that silver will be the same price as gold. This dude Silvergoldsilver saying gensler is leaving the country. Yawn. Tired of getting excited about so called epic events that that never happen.

  48. Rick, I agree with you. Everyone will get hungry. Degreed or not. People get ugly, smart or primitive. Formerly educated or just the school of life of hard knocks.
    Just seems to me the focused/smart individuals will be more prepared and reasonable and deliberate in their actions during a crisis. Preparedness is everything. So is situational awareness which I feel a lot of the general public might not be attuned to. You people here on TF's are highly focused and aware thus very smart in my estimation, degreed or not.
    Concerning a degree or piece of paper alot of people have earned through hard work/studying...I'm not one of them unfortunately (hard to even say "unfortunately" for not being college educated although I do wish one had happened. I'm not sure why I wish that but they are important for sure) I managed and mastered 3 skilled trades in my life so far.(Union certified plumber, welder and steamfitter, all learned and applied at different phases of my trades career and proud of it. They are not all the same trade in case some of you don't realize. There's the sily pride part showing itself again ;-)

    A degree doesn't guarentee smarts on a street or surviver level.
    I would rather be educated in a very broad general education sense then a a narrowly defined vocational way, when it comes to life's instincts or the lack thereof. A huge, diverse general education will serve a person far better and longer then some narrowly educated degreed types.
    (Don't get the wrong idea all you college grads. out there. I'm not knocking anything about that. Just a general statement for comparing specific intelligence vs. a broad intelligence of life skills in the here and now.)
    Formal education won't matter a whole lot if we get to the ugly primitive side of things in society. A broad knowledge base, street/survival instincts, a acute awareness of your situation/surrondings and a nasty streak within that we keep in reserve will be the best smarts you could hope to have IMHO.

  49. Gold investment in Japan and China compared:


  50. Marcel - I had commented earlier on that article. Basically two points - one it was too hard to understand. Many of the commenters here talked about having to read it two or three times. Occam's razor and all that. Two - lease rates have fallen, and were oddly high earlier, but if I am reading the charts at Kitco correctly then they are often this low and lower. That terms were used loosely does not surprise me. I used to read Minyanville about stocks but felt the articles were biased and attempted to move the market and make me worried wrongly a lot.

  51. Rick -

    I'm not trying to cover for Dark Purple, or implying that he needs it, but based on the nature of posts and the character he shows, he meant nothing negative about that "educated" comment.

    In my book, educated does not necessarily mean college graduate. It means anyone who educates themselves and increases their knowledge. Doesn't have to be in college. Over the last several decades, college "educations" have been on the same trend as the POSX.

  52. Silver chart is looking nice.

    DPH - mastering a trade and getting a degree can demonstrate a similar dogged streak that is a useful like skill. But good and bad people get both I am sure. But I agree with you that well rounded people are more likely to recognize their situation and respond more usefully than those who are distracted by the main stream flow of disinformation. And ignorance often presents an ugly face.

  53. Sorry for being a massive bummer, but we do have a impending situation our hands if the trends continue. I'm a realist like most of you and I don't like what I'm seeing on a global or domestic level. It doesn't breed confidence.

    Foresight and awareness is preparedness, thus necessary to prosper or to keep what you now have.

    I need to find a wickedly funny joke to post on here at some point :-P

  54. I mean, Ben Bernanke is highly educated. Look at where the well-educated lawyers have gotten us, And there is much truth in the salt of the earth idea. But education in general is a very good thing, and mankind's lot has been greatly improved through its wider dissemination.

  55. life skill, not like skill - like typing, a good life skill I should master.

  56. I had trouble getting into my position.

    I used a limit order above the prior day's close, but below the top of the range it has been trading in. Even then my order was not completely filled at the open and no further trades took place that day until the final hour before the bell.

    verif=searing, as in we're so close that Blythe feels our collective breath searing the back of her neck.

  57. had been telling a bunch of my co-workers last week about them moving some of their sittin' around doin' nothin' Bernankies into nice little shiney silver coins. Explained the best I could over and over the issues going on and the fundamentals. Skepticism is the best I could say they all had in their reactions because they had been totally unaware of anything except who their wives' favorite dancing with the grade D- stars were this season...pathetic...whipped!
    But today at lunch time I picked up the 20 Buffalos from GVille Coins that I bought last week (they were on backorder), and brought them back to work.
    I'll tell you what...those 20 bright and shiney little bastards caused WIDE eyes when I showed them to those guys.
    They almost seemed shocked as if I had just been talking a bunch of shit the week before! lol
    I said hey, since last week these are worth 20 bucks more and will most likely double before the end of the year...do ya get it now!???
    One guy said he was going to buy a bunch "for his wife for her birthday."!!! lol I guess that's as good of a start as any if you're going to finally wake up and leave the herd of sheeple behind.
    Then throughout the rest of the day they all wanted to know more, so I sent them my favorite web sites (and this isn't to kiss butt) but of course my first and favorite recommendation to them all was the Turd's site.
    I don't think they all have the time and dedication to research and read non-stop like I or most of you on here do, so I didn't want to overwhelm them. But I gave them a few more of my other daily reads: ZeroHedge, King World News, Trader Dan, Harvey, NetDania (to watch the live charts on silver, gold and the rest), and also SGS.
    I work in a big company in the IT dept....been there 11yrs now and have known a lot of these guys for a long time. Unfortunately, I only got wise to PM's about a year and a half ago. It's striking to me how few there are even in a line of work where most people are technologically intelligent, but still don't have a fucking clue what's been going on in America lately, or over the past 2 to 4 years, and especially the history going back to the early 1900's and prior to that back to the Revolutionary War.
    Most of these guys are mid-20's to late 30's (like me, 39 for a few more months), but most have to deal w/ the wife, kids, and since they're all computer geeks they spend their free time playing xbox online with each other. I don't get into gaming.
    And at this point I'm lucky to just have a really cool girlfriend who "gets it", and neither she nor I have kids to worry about.
    Granted that does allow me to spend more of my income on PM's now since I have less expenditures that those guys do, but that's where people need to wake up and see that if they don't use some of the dry powder they have now to store in PM's they're going to be fucked when the SHTF.
    I'm trying my best to wake people up and get them to understand time's a wastin' and the boat is leaving the dock.
    Just thought I'd share...it's gratifying to see people get that spark and wake up though. Hopefully it saves their ass one day and hopefully they will have passed the information on to the rest of their families and other freinds.
    I gotta give thanks to Turd and all who contribute on here. ZH as well...I found the Turd from reading ZH everyday and seeing his posts here and there, and then caught onto his new site.
    I've been reading and buying like a Mo'Fo ever since!!!

    Word Verification (this is awesome, lol) GOASTRO
    hell yeah! Silver to the moon! lol

  58. Sierra -

    Ted's response to Minyan article doesn't surprise. I've emailed him before and, in a very gracious and diplomatic way, told him that he was far more trusting of CFTC than I was, based on (mentioned all the reasons too long to mention here).

    Ted is old school. I've wondered if he was working for SLV at times. But here's where I net out:

    Mr. Butler is not working for SLV. He's a brilliant, good, honest man. He trusts the government too much. He's been at this silver manipulation business until it has become his life's work. He has evidently not been successful at motivating the CFTC for 20 years. But he has the heart of a badger, tunneling toward the truth.

    I'll always read Ted Butler and always want to hear his take on the silver market. He is persistent and passionate about silver.

    Ted Butler is Don Quixote. The manipulators of silver are his windmills.

  59. sorry all, directed @eric#1, but he'll know. . .

  60. Larry, thanks for having my back. Hope Rick and others didn't misunderstand. I like everyone and am easy to get along with. Meant no arogance. sorry if it sounded that way.

    OK...as I promised,

    A family took their frail, elderly mother to a nursing home and left her, hoping she would be well cared for. The next morning, the nurses bathed her, fed her a tasty breakfast, and set her in a chair at a window overlooking a lovely flower garden. She seemed okay, but after a while she slowly started to tilt sideways in her chair. Two attentive nurses immediately rushed up to catch her and straighten her up.

    Again she seemed okay, but after a while she slowly started to tilt over to her other side. The nurses rushed back and once more brought her back upright. This went on all morning. Later, the family arrived to see how the old woman was adjusting to her new home.

    "So Ma, how is it here? Are they treating you all right?"

    "It's pretty nice," she replied. "Except they won't let me fart."


  61. DPH,

    Chris Martenson quite rightly counsels that part of the responsibility placed on those who see what's coming is to prepare so that they are in a position to help their community once TSHTF.

    We need to spend as much time thinking about the world we'd like to see on the other side of this unfolding tragedy, as we do pondering which straw will break the camel's back.

    Catherine Austin Fitts ranks investment in family and community right up there alongside Au and Ag in the physical category.

    As part of my preparation, I chose not to dwell on how ugly people can get, but focus instead on sowing the seeds within my community now, for the future I envision.

    Promoting food security and food sovereignty within your community will help prevent the future you see from occurring.

  62. DarkPurpleHaze, Here's some humor for you!

    Did you know that "race car" spelled backward still spells "race car"?

    And, that "eat" is the only word that, when you take the first letter and move it to the last, it spells its' past tense, "ate"?

    And, have you noticed that if you rearrange the letters in "CFTC POSITION LIMITS" and add just a few more letters, it spells: "Get a freaking clue, you money-grabbing, back stabbing, revolution causing, TURD burglering, decaf no-whip non-fat latte drinking, scum sucking pigs."

    How weird is that???

  63. DPH - I believe that your observations are spot on - AND the SNAP program's move away from food stamps to credit cards makes the transition to anarchy one keystroke away. Just shut off the cards, wait a few days and ... voila! - Instant anarchy!

    My fear is that Ordo Ab Chao dictates that you need a good few days of anarchy to get us all to beg them to save us from ourselves. Whether that means FEMA style camps or just a new world currency/government - that's to be seen.

    In reality, the entire SNAP (Food stamps) program only runs on the order of $50 billion a year. Compared to the military, SS or medicare budget, it is a drop in the bucket. It's a tough argument to shut off those cards before you pull our boys back from overseas.

  64. Silver Run - nicely done. Thanks for the belly laugh.

  65. Arigato Turdle,
    It went over my head too,having owned/operated an okazu-ya, I have many Nihonjin tomodachi and speak sukoshi nihongo. So I'm glad that was cleared up as we have not heard from many from Miyage. I figured correctly it was me that was wakarimasen. A hui hou, malama pono kakou.

  66. DarkPurpleHaze & Larry...I suppose I jumped a little fast and hard. Sorry about that.I'm a carpenter and definitely uneducated. But when it comes to bankster conspiracy controlling the world I have an open mind enough to read the writing on the wall.

  67. Save America, its post like yours that make me raise the bong, and say Ahh!...We save another.


  68. SilverRunNW - that's just pure frikkin' gold.

  69. Larry,

    Ted Butler's writing got me into the silver market in 2005. I soon came to realize that Ted limited himself due to the reasons you stated. I agree wider reading is required to gain a complete picture of the silver market.

    However, His COT analysis always was, and remains, top notch. His freely shared knowledge in that area helped me to profitably trade the saw tooth pattern in silver price that existed between 2006 and 2008.

    For that, I am eternally grateful to him.

  70. I've never let my schooling get in the way of my education.
    Mark Twain or Livermore can't remember which as dey is no grades on da streets where I grew up.

  71. Rick if you know what the banksters are up to, you ain't uneducated. As I said above, mastering a trade and getting a college degree are really very similar - except trades are useful. (Obviously I have degrees - and am unemployed.)

  72. Thanks Greg & T.Mentality! I had to edit the original version; too controversial when the punchline refers to illegal immigrants and terrorists.

  73. Pretty much by choice, I should add. Lucky girl.

  74. DarkPurple - no worries, no big deal. You just seem like one of the good guys.

    SilverRun - LOL

    Marcel - You are so absolutely correct. We need more people like you in my neck of the woods. For those with eyes to see and ears to hear, there is much more to do than protect only ourselves with God's own honest, un-fooled-around-with currency.

    Like the flight attendant's say: in case of depressurization or smoke in the cabin, parents place oxygen masks on first and then the children. Must make sure we live so that we can help others survive.

    With all this talk of gloom/doom (the name-in-jest some of my friends have given me), I have to remember to post a first-hand account of my own experience and observations when I was in Peru for a month during their hyperinflation, but it's too late over here on the coast EST to try and do it justice. Was quite an experience. Hyperinflation is real... and ugly and scary and sad.

    G'nite all.

  75. I've got a really good one:

    A gambler and his layer go to see the gambler's accountant.

    The accountant looks over the gambler's tax return and says, "This can't be right, there is no way you've made this much money gambling!"

    The gambler says, "It is correct. I am a very good gambler! As a matter of fact I will make a bet with you right now, I bet you $150 I can bite my eye!"

    After some some thought the accountant agrees to the terms.

    The gambler pops out his glass eye, sticks it in his mouth, and bites it.

    The accountant is in disbelief.

    The gamber says, "I'll give you a chance to win your money back. Double or nothing I can bite my other eye?"

    After some thought the account realizes that there is no way they are both glass eyes and agrees to the terms.

    The gambler pops out his dentures, and bites his other eye.

    The accountant is sick to his stomach. He is now $300 in the hole.

    The gambler says, "OK, OK. One more bet. Double or nothing. I'll bet you I can pee in the trash can under your desk without getting a drop on any of your papers."

    After some thought the accountant decides it is physically impossible to pee over the desk and into the trash can.

    The gambler drops his pants and pees ALL OVER THE DESK!

    The accountant is jumping for joy.

    Then the accountant turns to the lawyer who looks sick to his stomach and asks, "What's wrong?"

    The laywer replies, "He bet me $1000 before we came in here that he could pee all over your desk and you'd be happy about it!"

    I thought it was a knee slapper....

  76. Anyone paying attention to events taking place in Peru? You should be. Ollanta Humala is on the verge of taking over. He is of the Hugo Chavez ilk. And Peru has a ton of copper and silver (I myself did not realize the silver reserves). Here is a link to a quick article explaining the political situation. http://www.thestreet.com/story/11064887/1/could-peru-threaten-global-recovery.html?puc=_booyah_html_pla3&cm_ven=EMAIL_booyah_html

    Question: what silver miners have Peru mine exposure in their portfolios?

    If Humala Humala Humala (sorry, just like saying that) wins, we could very well have ourselves some nationalized silver mines in our own portfolios. Want to know what happens when a guy like Chavez comes to power: KRY. Take a look at that 5-year chart and weep.

    HL lost a gold mine for pennies on the dollar too to CHavez.

    So, what miners are screwed if Humala takes charge and nationalizes the mines? A list for shorting might be appropriate.


  77. Marcel... I agree with your outlook about family, community education, preparedness for the good of all within the community etc.
    It just seems to me that before we get to that slightly Utopian part of it that guarding the garden or barn with a gun because all types of depserate people will at some point come scavaging about is what will happen first. Depends on where you live of course. The city will get a lot rougher before a rural outlying area does. That seems reasonable to assume.
    I don't sense alot of community togetherness right now on a broad level across the country just by gleening the news on a daily basis. Hope that changes and it gets better as we go along. People being nice on a large scale is a good place to start.
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Silver Run NW,
    Wow...I thought CFTC Position limits were a warning that Chinese Food to Tough to Chew was limited to one serving per person and you have to use a clean plate/utensils everytime you go up for seconds. Now I feel like a pig, and a weird one at that.
    You know whats really weird? I ate some funny mushrooms along time ago and my legs walked one way as I went the other way and I couldn't feel them attached to my body for a long time and I didn't even care! I think I actually laughed quite hard about it and asked "Has anyone seen my legs?"
    That was weird!

    I need to read up on Ordo Ab Chao.
    Thats not some good Chinese food place or a fortune cookie prophecy urging people to order more food is it?(silly sarcasm on)

    Any links for Ordo Ab Chao? You have me interested.

  78. Spencer....very nice. Made me smile.

  79. Marcel

    LOL, yeah I figured it out. But I have to admit when I first read "I had trouble getting into my position" I wasn't sure if you were talking yoga or what.

    A two edged sword on that BPM. If things go good, and some serious money wants to get in, that stock should fly. On the other hand, if things go bad, and we need to get out from under it, Lord help us finding a bid.

  80. We can no longer debate over “who”, is being served. I’m working on a letter…
    Mr. Gensler,
    Please take all of your rules and investigations and stick them elbow deep up your ass, because you are a sorry excuse for public servants. I’ve had enough. I gave you two years to prove your integrity, and you made JP Morgan a “vault” in short two days. I am out! Your paper games mean nothing more to me. This was never about fair price discovery, it’s was always about serving your wallstreet ponzi lords. You, Mr. Gensler, are truly a small man indeed. You have made me into a 100% buyer of physical gold and silver until the day that vultures fly circles over all of your sorry asses. Better Americans than you would be turning over in their graves at Arlington National Cemetery if they knew what you have done (or failed to do), for our great nation. I think of those who sacrificed everything for our principles, and then I think of you, who lack any at all. Now I know why they call it the “American Dream”; it’s because you have to be asleep to really believe in it. So thanks, guys.
    Anything I should add?

  81. PAAS has mines in Peru. I'll be very careful about the political situation over there.

  82. OK, I did my own research. PAAS, ssri, slw, bcm fortuna, Apex, and Buenaventura all have sizable Peruvian exposure.

    Invest accordingly.

  83. Spencer

    I'm still laughing ... and for that go here ... just classic Coach


  84. Good job on cheering up the place! Very funny jokes you guys. I'd add one but mine are all dirty and I try to stay respectable online. hehehehe

    It is hard to keep a positive attitude when things have been so crazy this last week or so. I guess I might be more immune than some folks just arriving to the doomsday party, since I've been on SHTF boards and thinking about how to repel zombie attacks for over 2 years now.
    There is a local group on meetup that I've joined and we are sharing ideas, getting together for campouts/training etc. It's nice to socialize with other "crazies" :-)

    But I'm VERY impressed by all the chatter here about getting prepped. I think more and more folks are starting to tune in and NOT drop out. Hopefully this will be a great sea change in our collective countries/states/towns. It could happen.

    The thing to remember is to be prepared for all events. Can you jam everything you NEED (keyword) into a vehicle and hit the road on a moments notice or do you hunker in and wait it out?

    Plan to have a place/shelter you can get to on a tank of gas as well as an outlying destination... just in case.

    Again.. this is not meant to be a downer. I'm just saying that if you have a good plan. One that meets your individual needs, you will feel a heck of a lot better and the feeling of readiness goes a long way towards trumping the negative stories flying about.

    Anyone here that is interested in hooking up in SoCal can give a shout and we'll share the secret handshake with you!

  85. CurmudJaiBrad

    If you do get your hands on a couple of Sovereigns, you will find that they seem nearly identical in size and "feel" to a Mex 10 Peso, which I think you said you had. Though the Peso has just a tiny fraction more gold.

    IMHO, though, the Sov is the far more appealing coin, then add in the British Empire history behind it, and all the places they minted it (London, Canada, Australia, South Africa, India). It's a winner. There's a zillion of them out there too, so they never command much of a premium.

    I do have a few 10 pesos, just because like I said, gold is gold if the price is right. But I don't seek them out.

    I'm like you in that I only want coins that I'm not afraid to touch. I like to take them out once in a while, look them over, hold them, count them, sort them, put some in my pocket, put them on the floor and roll around on them (ok just kidding on that one, sort of :)) It's gold fever, that's what it is.

  86. SSK, according to my FX-broker, SLW exploded into the close, just like you said. Jumped from 38 to 44.5. Damn, shoulda put some powder in there. ;)

    Guess hindsight is something i need to lose if i want to make it in this biz. :P

  87. Peru?

    Crap, and I just bought some Fortuna monday morning. :(

  88. Jimmy

    maybe a new broker is in order

    SLW high = 43.72
    low = 42.07
    close = 42.90

  89. Eric#1...

    Thanks! Hopefully those guys scratch up some Bernanky Bucks and buy in soon. The seed was definitely planted, so I hope it keeps them awake at night thinking about it until they finally can't stand it any longer and go get them some silver!

    I know I sleep better at night having my silver beauties safe and sound and guarded by 9mm, 45cal, .223, and 12 guage lead! : )

    party on!

  90. Not to hijack this thread but Ordo Ab Chao means order out of chaos. Cause chaos and take advantage of everyone running around with their hair on fire as you slip in your new order.

    You can google any of these phrases to start your jouney: "Hegelian Dialect" "Problem Reaction Solution" "False Flag" or just "Ordo Ab Chao". Any of these will show you how the masses have been manipulated for thousands of years by using these simple techniques.

    In fact, these techniques are so common that they have names. You'll have to dig a bit since most mainstream deffinitions won't have examples such as this article:

    Ok, sorry - back to silver and it's manipulation! The fact that silver is an industrial metal will keep it honest.

  91. Curmud-jai

    Here's a link to a site that has a lot of great pics of Sovereigns. Gold Porn!

    Ignore those prices though. They are talking slabbed coins.


  92. ZeroHedge:"Massive Raw Gold Shortage In China - Supply And Demand Crunch Looms"

    Click link above and watch video. In the raw words of wisdom every ZH poster has blurted out at one point or another... "GOLD BITCHEZ!"


  93. A Govt. shutdown might be the very thing that propels the PM's higher past their mostly stuck ranges.
    Not to mention a lower POSX and thus higher oil and voila...higher PM's. Sounds possible to me.
    Uncharted territory all the way around these days and anything seems possible.

    Is it just me or does it seem totally surreal (or expected?) that all the politicians have supposedly given up and will let the Govt. shutdown just so they can get serious and THEN actually do something after the fact? How's that for a plan?
    Wow, inaction and possible insolvency as a motivational planning tool, what a concept.

  94. DPH @5:04PT -

    This overly educated (two under-utilized masters degrees) schlob whole-heartedly agrees!

  95. so reading harvey and everyone else it looks like no one knows how they settled the silver contracts? is that the correct interpretation?

  96. SilverSurfer, luv your photo/icon

    ZeroHedge has such great articles, and they used to have people commenting with very insightful thoughts. Now, I'm afraid, it's gone to the trolls.

    I swear, ZeroHedge is being subtlety attacked. I read the articles, and look at the first few posts. If it's trash talking, I move on to the next article.

    Hmm, is that the point of the troll attack!! Stop/dissuade a good debate?

  97. OK, one last shot of British Sovereign Gold Porn! Couldn't resist.

    My pile of Sov's is not that big.....yet!


    Again, ignore those prices though. THis site has great pics but their prices are way way out of line.

  98. Test Post. Please disregard. Only meant for trolls.

    ........('(...´...´.... ¯~/'...')
    ...........\.............. _.·´

  99. OK, I'm "keeping an eye on crude" here Wed. 9am and it's down .23 at 104.56, while gold is up 10.30 at 1429. The theory and the facts are not in sync at this time.