Friday, April 22, 2011

Our Only Hope: You

So I'm flipping through the channels late Wednesday night and I stop on O'Reilly visiting with Lou Dobbs. I notice that they're talking about oil prices so I figured I'd give it a listen.

As the interview dragged on, I was amazed at their points of view.

O'Reilly: Its all the evil speculators, oil companies and OPEC who are at fault. They are driving up the price of oil for their own benefit and screwing the consumer.

Dobbs: It's all Obama's fault. He should be putting the screws to OPEC to force them to pump more oil and bring the price down.

That these guys are apparently so clueless bugged me all day yesterday. In fact, I even discussed this on the phone with Mr. Hyde. How could these guys not get it? Anyone with a brain knows that crude is going up because of concerns of unrest in the Middle East and, more importantly, the rapidly declining dollar. But here are O'Reilly and Dobbs taking 5 minutes in front of O'Reilly's massive audience to construct bogey men for everyone to blame. WHY? Seriously, this really bugged me.

I got my answer yesterday when I saw this:


And it all began to fall into place. The O'Bottom regime knew that the President was going to be discussing this nonsense yesterday. So, they put out a call to their new buddy, O'Reilly. Remember, O'Reilly owes them a few favors after they granted him the exclusive interview back on Super Bowl Sunday, O'Reilly obliges by gladly staging this interview to give the President some political cover. Adding Dobbs to the segment to criticize Obama gives O'Reilly cover, too. Pretty handy, huh?

Do you now see how you are manipulated? The Fed/TBTF/Govt/Media Complex is desperately clinging to power. Again, anyone with a brain knows that oil is rising because its denominated in dollars. It's the reason corn is rising. It's the reason gold is rising. It's the reason the stock market is rising. The world is awash in dollars, willfully printed by the Federal Reserve, to fund the U.S. government ponzi scheme. If you want to control inflation and bring the cost of crude oil down, you stop printing money and make the U.S. government function on revenues alone.

But that's not going to happen, now is it? Nope. No way. So long as the politicians and their willing accomplices in the media can construct straw men upon whom you can vent your anger, change will never come. Your politicians will distract your neighbors from focusing on the real problem (the politicians) by encouraging them to chase dead ends and ghosts, instead.

Our only hope is each other. We must educate and help each other and then we must help as many of our friends, family, neighbors and coworkers as we can. It is up to us to do it ourselves. I'm willing to risk everything trying to help. Are you? Do you know what you believe? What is it that you know to be true? Are you willing to stand in front of others and proclaim this truth, knowing that you will be criticized, ridiculed and marginalized by those who choose to let normalcy bias rule them? We must try. If not for ourselves, for posterity.

Thomas Jefferson wrote of this 235 years ago. It is clearly still valid today. I leave you today with his words to ponder:

When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.


  1. First! There. I did it once. Just for fun!

  2. Exactly on point.... Thanks Turd!

    BTW, read this:

  3. Taking aim at yet more junk silver - another roll of pre '64 Washington Quarters for $330.

    Somebody talk me out of it, please.

  4. 3rd

    I don't care what they say about you, don't stink.

    Really looking forward to the new platform. I'm a hardcore Turdite now, thanks for your hard work.

  5. 4th!
    And somebody just woke up. XAG quotes bouncing all over the place now with $1 plus spreads :)

    I saw the same and came to the same conclusion as you. I was ranting out loud how much BS the whole boogie-man speculator thing was. JEEZ. If you feel like your being taken to the cleaners at the gas pump, it only makes sense to buy Exxon stock and oil futures. That way, you get some back :)

  6. This will be of interest also:

    And this:

  7. You probably know already, but you got a mention in this Hitler video:

  8. Those days are over, Turd. They were a beautiful experiment, never as pure as we would like to envision them, but long gone now.

  9. Great post Turd. I see us Turdlings have a brilliant leader.

    RON PAUL IN 2012!

  10. DISINFORMATION by MAINSTREAM MEDIA and political bs by obomba near election paid for by corporations and imf bankers to confuse the real reasons behind commodity rises as the truth was getting out so the disinformation campaign is now needed

  11. Maybe we should just dissolve the USA and start fresh? Let each state form whatever bonds with others it chooses. (No, I am not a native Southerner, but I have lived here a long time and maybe I've been assimilated. :0 )

    Jefferson was a Southerner and anti-Wall Streeter, you know.

    Thanks, Turd!!

  12. @ Mammoth Do what you are led to do to protect your fortune (buying power) and family.

    @ Turd: The Constitution isn't taught any more in the public schools. Too much haggling over that Creator type guy; I guess He gets in the way of the real progress we are seeing in our country today :(.

  13. Amen brother! Buy silver and land!

  14. also we have enough oil in alaska and texas to make oil shieks look like welfare recipients

  15. Bravo Tf, bravo.

    It is a bit mind blowing to hear the MSM talk about almost everything except what actually might be going on. They have picked only two sides to their arguments and don't (or can't) look at it any other way except Dem. vs. Repub.
    It bothers me also that the majority of people who listen to some of these talking heads are basing these ideas as their sole basis of information. It's easier to have some other "experts" form idea's for the 99% who aren't interested or really don't want to know the core (and obvious) reasons.
    We all need to continue to think outside the box. The box that is the square TV or the computer monitor in front of us. It's hard sometimes because the stream of safe MSM idea's are continuous and everywhere if you see them for what they are.

    Happy Easter Holiday TF to you and yours.

    (Mr. Hyde? We don't have to consider some type of Jekyll thing do we? :-)

  16. Turd you da man. I might have fallen for this MSMBS a few years ago because I didn't understand money at all or who really controls it. Mine eyes have seen the glory of Silver/Gold money and the Truth is marching on! I am ready to risk it all but I do fear the police state. I have been a victim of it once and it was not a pretty site. I do believe the tide is turning and it will be a steep learning curve for most folks.

    I draw the line at wearing tea bags hanging from a 3 corner hat though... but I do look smashing with a cheese hat so a Turd hat is not that different! :-)

  17. Pailin

    That's exactly why I've owned oilsands producers like Suncor on and off for almost 10 years.

  18. This comment has been removed by the author.

  19. Get as many people into the lifeboats as you can. Pray for our country.

  20. BTW...I'm no hardcore Glen Beck listener, but he is supposed to have some type of story on the Fed and what their end game is in his opinion.
    He does make a lot of sense at times . Other times it seems a bit too animated and maybe that just throws off the message.
    I take evrything I listen to with a huge chunk of salt and form my own beliefs.

  21. What's wrong with the silver charts?? I am showing Silver hit $47.90 on Why isn't Kitco moving?

  22. Wow TF. Very, very powerful. We each need to do whatever we can to talk to people, discuss true cause and effect, and get this stuff out there. And it can open you up to ridicule or cause people to single you out as the 'out-there' person, which none of us enjoy. But it really needs to be done.

  23. Jekyll Island was the beginning of the only have to look at the "owners" of the Federal Reserve (don't bother they are layered in anonymity) to find out why oil is up etc. But if you believe that they are going to HYPERINFLATE the debt away you are very foolish. THEY own the debt....they aren't letting you hyperinflate it away....hhehehe. We will get continued stagflation until the sheeple break.....then they will pull the punch bowl away...hehee...give um another

  24. I have got my Options account funded with 5K.. I took monday off I will be ready to buy my first option. Any advice for a noob? I will have my mother make the same play, she is gonna put up 100K.

    Any help is much appreciated.

  25. Part 2

    Another concept they may be helpful to accept is the following. Initially, most including myself (not anymore) think that buying physical metals is a risky investment. But what you may want to consider is that by holding paper wealth it is losing value on a daily basis. The dollar index in 2002 was at 120, it is now at 75. Therefore your paper dollars have lost 38.5% against a basket of other paper currencies which also suck.

    Due your own due diligence, buy an initial investment right away, try to buy when the prices get pushed down or at least dollar cost average. Do not under any circumstances buy paper investments like SLV or GLD! This is just another way for the Bankers to divert your investment away from the real physical commodity.

    One final thought. Just this week the U. Of Texas Endowment Fund made an announcement that they are talking PHYSICAL delivery of $1 billion dollars worth of gold from their paper investment. Institutional ownership of metals is less than 1% of all of their investments. If other institutions and endowment funds follow along the prices will rise even more quickly. In addition, if they stand for physical delivery there will not be enough to go around at anything close to today's prices. From what I read they forecast $1650 gold and $50 silver faster than you might imagine.

    Finally, some say think of owning metals like an insurance policy against the devaluation of paper money.

    Feel free to forward this to your friends although I would appreciate it if you would cut and paste my name out of it. I don't want for everyone to think I am wearing a tin foil hat!

  26. For anybody who is interested in the 'America the Beautiful' series of 5-oz bullion coins, if you go to the APMEX website and key "Glacier" or "Gettysburg," in the search window, you can add your name to the list to be notified when these first two of the 2011 bullion coins become available.

    You're welcome.

  27. I think it's too late for a rally by the "public". Too many people are too ignorant and asleep. Hypnotized by the TV sets from which their reality emerges.

    Turn off your TV!!! I can't say that enough.

  28. I have been fighting Tyranny since my awakening. I am buying physical silver to crash JP Morgan and have made several videos touting silver as real wealth.
    I have become a sovereign in Missouri and am supporting the De Jure government
    I am all in. The global elitists can go to hell. I will die on my feet rather then live on my knees.
    Keep up the great posts Turd, can't wait for the new site.

  29. Hey TF,

    That's why these particular rounds are so cool. Life, Liberty, Happiness!

  30. Turd you da man. Even guys at JPM's bunker admitted they read your blog ;)

  31. Watch out for counterfeit coins showing up

  32. INO silver jumpin between 46.60 to 47.57?

  33. I'm really confused. Can someone explain why the silver price is moving on It just jumped a dollar.

  34. I've said it before and I'll say it again. All government is evil. This is yet more evidence.

    They create a massive monetary problem and then try to prevent anyone from protecting themselves from the fallout. Total bullshit and only something a true megalomaniac could fathom.

  35. Personally I feel like there's going to be a big PM sell off in the near future. The TPTB are going to REALLY try shaking loose PMs so they can suck them up. You MUST hang on during this time -- they will go back up eventually.

    I think this event will occur soon. In fact, I think this event will be the end of QE2. There won't be an immediate QE3. Watch out for June. There will eventually be a QE3+, but they want to shock the system first.

  36. We tried to form our own gov't in 1861 but Lincoln invaded so as not to lose the tax revenues. 75-85% came from the South. Next time will be even uglier but it is due.

  37. flaunt!!

    Long time no see, man.

  38. has anyone commented as to why kitco says silver is at 46.63 but other sites say 47.7. check coin flation and other sites besides kitco. I hear apmex is still up using 46.6, if so could mean silver under spot

  39. Turd:

    Are you referring to you and your golf game by saying “bogey man”, or do you mean the scary monster in the closet boogeyman? Haha…just bustin your balls.

  40. @Mark, et al
    There's thin volume trading going on somewhere. If anybody knows where, please post it. Price is jumping around a lot because of that. I'm really impatient to see how Sunday 6pm opens!

  41. kliguy38

    I've always been fascinated by the Panic of 1907. Especially during the Crash of 2008 I re-read a lot about 1907 trying to get some perspective. Interesting to think that the Panic of 1907 may actually have been the start of much of our troubles today. Thanks for the link.

  42. Just dragging these forward as there has been a lot of SLW talk going on here.

    Silver Wheaton sees new deals within months
    10:39 AM, E.T. | April 21, 2011


    Silver Wheaton Corporation: Lackluster performance of late

  43. 24hgold, and gainsville silver

  44. Wow, history is really just a prologue. I'm working on educating folks around me on the fundamentals of PMs. Their price rise (tail spin of the USD) opened some ears of people I thought I hadn't reached before.

    An important arguement is the long term perspective. Bob Chapman says in this interview form Wednesday, that we're not even 30% through the Gold and Silver bull.

    It helps to calm the emotions of missing out, feeling stupid, having ego in the game, shutting down and falling back into normalicy bias.

    We have a long road in before us, let's push through and pass the word on. It becomes a self fulfilling profecy.

    If all the millionaires in the world try buy a couple of ounces, then Sprott's struggle to get physical would look like taking milk out of the fridge.

    We're all sudents and teachers. I'm mentally ready, willing and able to pass the word out.

    Godspeed, Silver and Gold, glad I know you two.

  45. Just checked in at ZH and there is a article about Ag going up overnight inspite of the holiday.

  46. ^^Bob Chapmans interview:

  47. hey darkpurple you must not be a glen beck watcher cause dat show dun got canceled after he was exposed as a sorros pansy by infowars

  48. yeah what the heck?

  49. @Waffen (PART I)

    Good for you. First piece of advice is take it easy until you feel seasoned. Options are a sharp knife that cuts both ways. There is no question what the long term trend is in silver & gold, but even Turd admits he does not know which way it will go in the next week, so give yourself time and plenty of slack.

    Download and read the Options Trading Simplified primer by Chris Rowe at If you haven't already, read up on trading discipline and emotions. I recommend The Disciplined Trader by Douglas.

    And heed these sage words from another Turdite:

    Alex said... (4/16/11 2:01AM EDT)
    If you’re new to options be very careful with otm options. Not understanding the real risks in options trading is the single largest mistake new options traders make.

    Here’s some insight to help the newer options traders fully understand the risk and “prepare accordingly”

    Otm calls offer the most leverage and therefore the most opportunity for profit and loss. That’s why you see so many people buying the SLV $41 – 45 options.

    The unforeseen error many newer traders make has to do with moving the goalposts. If you’ve been reading this blog, you know that it was a very short time ago that the price of silver was in the mid $30’s and we were all cheering for the price to reach $40.

    Well, we hit 40. Winners!! Now what? -We moved the goalposts and now everyone is calling “$45 by Friday”

    Options traders do the same. When AG was $35 traders bought the SLV $37-39 calls 2 months out (and let’s say at $1). AG moved correctly to $40 and those calls became worth let’s say $3 and were closer to expiry at which point they needed to be sold. That’s one happy trader! What’s he do next? Well the most obvious thing is to change the goalposts “AG 45 next!” so the trader sells his original calls and buys the $44-45 calls 2 months out for $3 hoping to turn the $3 into $8

    If he’s lucky he gets $8 and goes for $20

    Do you see the issue?


  50. can anyone confirm these charts I'm on my phone. some say silver its up to 48 of so any site with the old charts are buying opportunities

  51. @ Mammoth,

    I bought a bunch of quarters at about 33.00 spot.
    Being one of the ants, I think 90% is wise.
    My opinion is that you can justify your purchase by calling it dollar cost averaging. I'm personally keeping dry powder for a bit of a pullback. Admittedly it may never come.
    I think most agree that the run to 50 is probably in the cards short term...but then what?
    I posted last night about purchasing 2 boxes of half dollars from my bank. That's 2000 halves.
    We found Franklin, liberty, and 90% & 40% Kennedy's. Don't remember exactly, but I think we figured about $300.00 in silver at about 37 or 38 dollars, so a handful of ozs. for really cheap. You can try this too. My next 2 boxes are on the way.
    A pullback to 40 or 42?? Who knows. Straight to 60? That's why we're all glued to the screen. Good luck.

  52. Tim

    I was wondering the same thing about the difference between the two charts.

  53. Regarding Kitco's reporting of the silver price, Tulving goes by Kitco and they're quoting the Kitco price right now. Just saying...

  54. Unfortunately scapegoating is convenient.

    This also means that they have absolutely no plan to change course.



  55. @pailin: could you sell off your positions now even if you wanted to?

  56. Also looks like Gainesville and First Majestic prices are still based on spot at 46 and change.

  57. Pain at the pump is just a media "no brainer" to fill air time... it is on every news cast because it hits home to all.

    Billy is worried about his cash cow, and he wants to get as far away from GB as he can (even Billy can see how that act ends... the people HAVE spoken). So, he's taken a giant leap towards sanity, and has been "opining" dangerously close to reason of late (me thinks is most likely a short term plan).

    As far as the administration goes, it's a no brainer as well (who doesn't want lower gas prices), and they must be seen doing something... anything. If WTI pulls back at all, it's a (cynical) political win, since the vast majority of voters have no idea, or interest, in the workings of commodity trading. If it doesn't, at least they're seen doing something... just politics as usual.

    As for these two working together, what is... less likely than a Wall Street banker having empathy for a beggar on the street?

    Happy Easter to all!

  58. CIA Drone Strike Kills 26 in Pakistan

    Seems to be escalating over there and not abating.

  59. People generally cannot be convinced of anything that is not in their sphere of experience. To try to do so is an exercise in futility, the only slim chance you have is that they may be ever so slightly inclined in the direction you want to push them in. My suggestion is to point them in the direction of "A Short History of Financial Euphoria" by John Kenneth Gailbraith; it can be read in an evening and is entertaining and informative. If they read it and broaden their sphere of experience, they may then begin to listen to your suggestions. I read it about ten years ago and am doing very well as a result.

  60. Bullion direct is listing their current price at $47.63, Apmex is $46.66. Awesome.

  61. Kitco goes by U.S. trading days/hours which is why the chart isn't moving since U.S. markets are closed today.

    After hours silver on Wednesday was crazy and there was some obviously unnatural action taking place in the 1min charts for silver, I posted here about it and nobody seemed to be that interested. Yesterday after U.S. markets closed it happened again and BrotherJohnF included the irregularity in his silver update video last night. Today it is taking place yet again, but with bigger $1 dollar swings. Something is askew in the silver market. Look at the end of the silver chart here.

    Watching silver last week and all of the bullish news coming out in support of it was all I needed to see to stay long going into the weekend. Our current cycle I mentioned yesterday is set to hit $48 on Monday and it looks like that will happen. If we see a $2 correction after that, next rally is to $54.

  62. Good article about the recent Liberty Dollar trial:

  63. Many of us here are very cautious of what Edward stated. It only makes sense really. Timing is everything and none of us here are privvy to what TPTB know and will do. We do know that a cornered rabid animal will not just lie down and succomb. Take each day to examine, ponder, question, plan, and then just do the very best that you can. Investment and otherwise. I am firm believer that once you do what you are called to do... the part that is out of your hands will eventually work out for His glory and our good. It is a promise that I claim and stand on. Not that there won't be pain along the way. Pain notwithstanding, I refuse to give up that hope & promise. Keep your faith in things that you know are true. Sorry if I offend some. But this is the faith that I have.

    Turd is right. Our country got way off track. It would not be recognizeable to the founders. There is great evil on this earth. These things have not gone unpredicted either. I guess I just want all to see the great hope even in the face of seeming hopelessness. Miracles can still happen and we [can] become a better stronger nation/world/people. Even if TPTB have a titanic complex. They think they are unsinkable and unstoppable. Turd is right that we can and must be the ones to make a difference for oursleves and others and not wait for someone else to step up. I will change a phrase to suit this... We have seen the heros and they are us....

    I try not to be a 'preachy' person or one to push anything I believe on others. But I just know what I believe and feel obligated to put it out there for consideration. In the end.. ..This WILL all be ok. One way or the other. TPTB that we speak of can and do win lots of battles. ..My comfort is in KNOWING.....they will not win the war against TPOG! (The Powers Of Good:)

    Happy Eater All! ....Headed out of town now and will check to see what kind of trouble you all have caused when I get home! ;)

  64. This link has good charts with updated prices:

    Not sure where the trading is going on though. But that big spike has drifted lower to 47.16 as I type. If this continues, I'll be making a big physical purchase this weekend in anticipation for next week.

  65. @Old Navy

    I have some free time this weekend and I'd like to pickup a (currently relevant) book or two on options trading for noobs.

    Any recommendations?

  66. For the physical holders:
    - price guess end of 2012

    Not a contest like Turd's, just curious as the communitiy's thoughts

  67. keep talking like this, Turd, and you may very well find yourself on the TSA watchlist.....

  68. watching this action in PMs makes me extremely nervous and sad. all Zhers recall the anticipation of QE2 and the validation in upward PM prices that followed. I think everyone, trolls included had unsettling anxiety. You feel good that your investment strategies have been more than validated, but simultaneously the destruction of the dollar and everything that comes with that are validated. dont foget to also give serious thought to water, energy, food, health, shelter and security as you do wealth in the scenario that is playing out in front of our very own eyes! GL and GB us all.

  69. uh.. 'Happy EATER' .....should have been 'Happy EASTER' ! :D (fruedian slip?)

    ......i need me some more cheesecake. stupid diet... ;D

  70. @unum mountaineer

    I agree, I posted a similar sentiment yesterday. It feels good to be validated in your purchase but with the price going up so fast it seems as though or currency maybe falling at the same rate.

  71. The media keeps saying 4 dollars and now today they say 6 dollar gas by summer. Is this sort of daily media blah blah going to make it less painful at the pump when gas hits 4.5 or 5 by summer and are we supposed to say oh well it could have been 6 like they said.

  72. Bullion Vault silver:
    bid $46.94
    ask $47.28
    (for metal in the London vault).

  73. Great post - the Jefferson Memorial is a beautiful site to see while in DC.
    The frustration is mounting as we make way through this great unraveling and misinformation.

    I can take small actions - here are a few I am doing or planning to do:

    1. Continue to buy gold and silver bullion - sovereign 1 oz are my preference - Eagles, Leafs, etc.

    2. Have a stockpile in case of spot shortages - necessities of food, water and energy backup - I use the Emergency Essentials site ( Credible folks are saying even more serious disruptions could be coming.

    3. Take advantage of the markets now - increase your wealth over the next few months by taking even small risks - you will be rewarded. Listen to Turd, Dan, Santa, Casey and your own intuition.

    4. Keep trying to knock sense into your representatives - keep the letters and emails going and maybe by some luck of faith a tipping point will occur and the banksters, etc will be put to rest.

    5. Keep trying to set an example for the sheepels and remind them that they need to get off the kool-aid and start taking more responsibility for their lives. The government dole is laced with arsenic.

    6. Look to your local community - many impressive cooperatives are happening. It may be that is all we will have to depend upon. I have read the Partiot and really hope we do not devolve into that scenario, but a vibrant local group creates much needed synergy as we become more isolated from effective government participation. I belong to is one of the Transitions Network ( in North Georgia.

    7. Get back into tithing - I am not a very religious person, but am spiritual - giving to those who need help is important - pick and choose according to your values - don't forget the animals and shelters for those who are being abandoned.

    8. Re-Read the words in this post often to maintain a clear vision and also support the good folks like Turd who are looking out for our interests.

  74. fantastic stuff,i dont buy or sell options like you guys/dolls,i'm a horse racing bettor! i'm on here for the education! what i've learnt is brill! keep up the excellent work!!!!!

  75. For your in-laws who are still completely unaware and are pissed that you bring the subject up:

    Wall Street Laughs at Main St. - this short video is funny, in German, and does not feature Adolph Hitler.

    Damn. I got issues...

    Ol' Michael

  76. There appears even here and at ZH a certain minority that really don't get QE, i.e. money printing.
    These are the immutable facts( well, and some conjecture):
    - The USA has unfunded liabilities estimated to be over $100T
    - the yearly deficit is now over $1.5T and increasing
    - tax revenues cannot begin to cover current budget, even if jobs return, taxes rates are increased, VAT added, whatever
    - the out-go is just too huge, and worse the % that is interest keeps increasing
    - Conjecture but I believe accurate: traditional buyers of Treasuries are not buying anymore, and in fact are selling
    - The Fed is the largest ( only?? ) buyer of treasureies
    - without QE continuing, the government has no source of revenue beyond tax revenue which is wholly too low, so it shuts down.
    QE cannot end abruptly, and since there is no serious talk of real budget cuts, it won't end non-abruptly either
    - serious deep budget cuts and/or new revenue sources are the only non-QE ways to keep gov liquid and functioning; anyone see that happening short-term?

  77. Is jimijon from ZH here on TF's blog? If so, stand up so we can see you. If not, he should be:

    by jimijon
    on Fri, 04/22/2011 - 10:21

    Well.. I minted my first coin and would enjoy a partner to mint a second coin.

    $3500 for the die and the artwork sculpting

    The rest... the price of silver.. minimum of 500 oz.


    you can reach me at

  78. @CurbYourMaltusiasm

    Just the three things I always recommend to noobs:

    Chris Rowe's Options Trading SImplified (free download at

    The Disciplined Trader by Douglas

    Trading For A Living by Elder

    There are many more experienced options traders on this board who may be able to address your question, one on particular posted a very long list which I have saved but will have to post it later today as I am about to be busy for a while. However, sometimes the real experienced guys can overwhelm you with all the complexities of options. If you want to do what I (and Turd) do, which is buy calls on a solidly uptrending market, it's really not complex at all, but does require discipline and attention.

    I'll try to post that book list later today.

  79. yea i posted a bunch from amazon earlier, if someone can repost the list. i'm of the belief that one should have a good deal of knowledge trading options... at least u should understand the basic difference between near-term and far-month options and the relationship with delta and theta. also the difference between atm, itm, or otm options.

    even though this is a solid uptrending markets, u need to plan ur trade and trade ur plan. if u spend $1k on otm options and they triple over night doesn't mean it will always work that way 70+% of otm options expire worthless and a good amt of people get shaken out. at the least know what u r doing and how u can be shaken out.

  80. Thank you, Turd. I have used your most salient thoughts to create a post to my blog today, linking to my FB. Between the two I will touch about 200,000. This needs to go viral. Doing my part ...

  81. Getting back to the actual topic of Turd's post...

    BOR is, as usual, full of it. The Dems/liberals ALWAYS blame high oil prices on speculators, and always call for an investigation - as if trying to make some money calling the direction of a market is some kind of crime. Well, anyway, it makes for good political theater and always, always diverts attention away from the idiots in Congress (but I repeat myself).

    Dobbs is also incorrect, but not wholely so. Part of the problem with oil prices now, as in 2007, is supply - but there were no gas lines or rationing then, nor is there any now.

    No, the problem is perception about the direction of things. Right now, the perception is that the future supply is limited and, of course, there could be some huge shock coming from the Mideast. But there are actually plenty of sources of usable energy out there, we simply have to be willing to go after it - it is NOT a physical or an economic problem, it is ONLY a political one. Note that in 2007, Bush lifted a ban on permitting for oil offshore, and within days the price started coming down. Where I live, we went from about $3.90/gallon down to $1.45 or so within about 5 months (check it out for the US average or your area at ).

    Obama could lift the ban with a stroke of his pen. He could push through drilling in ANWR within a couple of weeks, and ditto on a significant relaxation of the absurd EPA regs on shale oil recovery (and we're floating on oceans of shale oil - many times the entire Saudi reserves).

    Further, if he gave a shit about this country, Obama would push for a Manhattan Project-style program to develop liquid salt thorium reactors. Briefly, there's about 13 times the energy in the thorium inside of coal as the coal itself yields from burning. That energy could and should be used to generate electricity, replacing all coal-fired plants over a couple of decades. Some of the heat from the reaction could be used to drive the Fischer-Tropsch reaction to liquify that very same coal (just like the Germans did in WW2 when they got cut off from their sources of oil), thereby replacing all of our imports. Thorium reactors are, by their nature, virtually incapable of producing fissionable products that terrorists could go after, so that's not a problem, nor is a melt-down. FYI, we have about 200 years worth of domestic coal, even assuming a 1%/year increase in population, so that'd give us plenty of time to develop a follow-on energy source (most likely fusion) and methods to store it (i.e. batteries). For many more details on this set of ideas, go to

    We should also continue to develop wind and solar, but understand that these cannot possibly provide for even the growth in our energy needs, let alone replace existing production - and that they are not exactly dependable, and will ALWAYS need back-up power generation from more conventional sources. But, they are useful in certain areas where there's a lot of sun or wind - for example, why not put a solar water tank on every roof in the southern US? Israel does this and saves tremendous amounts of energy. We could mandate that all new refrigerators and upright freezers have the motor on top (as we did decades ago) to improve efficiency by 30% or more. We could allow many more diesel-powered autos, as is done in Europe. Many little things could be done to conserve energy, none of which are a total solution but all of which, combined, will save enormous amounts of energy. MOST importantly, they will, when combined with more drilling and the prospect of the massive use of thorium reactors and coal liquification, drive the price of oil down to somewhere in the $50-$60 range in a short time, thereby giving the economy a shot in the arm.

  82. CD: Wonder where he gets them minted? I know you can get coins custom made at the Northwest Territorial Mint and they will even do the artwork for free. I pondered making some a while back for fun. Maybe we can get some Turd rounds minted for all the good folks here :-)

  83. If Lindsey Williams has any credibility, he's saying the same thing as O'Reilly too. If you want to listen to him on Alex Jones's show last week, he's saying high oil prices (controlled by the nefarious NWO) are the plan to get rid of all the Middle East rulers, with the House of Saud being last.

    Taken at face value, he's seems ludicrous, but he did call the $140 to $60 fall in WTI back in 2008 and there is also an analyst, Wm. Engdahl, who, to me at least, has a little more credibility saying basically the same thing.


  84. "I'm willing to risk everything trying to help."
    All who read your post and similar want to be help I am sure your first duty is to your self and family.

    "Throw the corn, don't call the fowl" (Bob Marley)

    From Santa's Website:
    Good afternoon Jim,

    Just a short note to say thank you for securing our future retirement. Our Canadian registered retirement savings plans are now over $1,ooo,ooo. We are now able to have the freedom to choose what we want to do.

    One of the 2 Canadian senior’s charities that I work for is being questioned as to why half of our investments are in real gold. Some authorities consider this a “risky” investment! Our charity has doubled its investment value and we are still getting complaints. What is the best way to answer?

    Again, you have helped us personally and our charities. Thank you so much for all you do for us seniors.

    Best wishes,
    CIGA M

    Dear CIGA M,

    How do you answer fools?

    You can never convert the party that thinks US T bills are no risk, and gold is a risk. They have been socialized into Financial Terminal Ignorance (FTI, an incurable virus that affects sheeple only).


  85. Congrats to the winner, now I wanna see the picture in the big Yellow Hat! Sorry my 52.52 was just a feel-good WAG but hey, it's just a matter of time... Like $5 gas is just another step on the way to $6. Or $7. One way to explain what's happening is to show charts of Au and Ag inverted. When presented properly (as declining slopes, left to right) they simply indicate the value of the purchasing power of the fiat dollar. And a time frame has been announced. We're in what I call that "Wile E. Coyote moment" even as I type.

    If the first 96+% has been stolen and it's taken almost 100 years, note what happens as the last few percent is stolen and erased over the next someteen months. As one approaches Zero, various mathematical and economic factors start to act very strangely. That is without taking into account - as of course one must - the many various headfakes, noting with caution their sources.

    I'm with ya, Pat and Stan and CD and so many others...

    Think I'll tip another to the Turdmeister! :-)

    Ol' Michael
    "...paper is paper..."

  86. Two US drones for Misratah vs Russian arms, Chinese intel for Qaddafi
    April 22, 2011, 5:33 PM (GMT+02:00)

    Both of Libya's fighting camps are taking delivery of a surging influx of weapons shipments and military personnel – each hoping to use the extra aid for breaking the military standoff in its own favor.
    Thursday, April 21, President Barack Obama authorized a pair of armed Predator drones to help the rebels break breaking the siege of Misratah, while British, French and Italian military officers headed for rebel headquarters in Benghazi, part of a package of arms and military equipment from the US, Britain, France, Italy and Qatar.

    On the other side of the Libyan divide, China, Russia, Ukraine, Belarus and Serbia are keeping the pro-Qaddafi camp's arsenals stocked with new hardware along with combat personnel from Eastern Europe and the former Yugoslavia....
    The rest at
    There are much bigger things going on then meets the eye or ear and I have not heard one MSM channel mention the Russia, China angle at all.

  87. @kiyotei -- that is a wonderful idea. I think jimijon is talking about doing it himself, but I could be wrong.

  88. Global silver market just officially closed for the weekend. Final spot price: $47.65, $1.02 more than Kitco closing price yesterday.

    SGR is 32:1. Watched it dip down to 31:1 numerous times today, those consecutive $1 price swings today were unreal.

  89. All veterans remember, your oath was to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic. I don't remember there being an expiration date to that oath.

    Just saying.

  90. @Old Navy

    Thank you kindly. I will read all 3 of those recommendations.

  91. Justin

    received notice in my email this morning that Brother John had posted a new video on SLV and was going to get to it later. Saw your post and just went to it from there. The guy is really kind of a super sleuth in a way. Good info and a much watch for all here ... see Justin at the 11:24 mark on this page

  92. Thanks for the insight. Using their excuses to go after oil speculators, the next logical step then would be to go after the gold and silver speculators for destabilizing the dollar, correct? If so, then the experiment is surely getting desperate!

  93. Turd,

    One of the greatest quotes from a true American!
    Too bad 95% of our populace had their heads up their asses and glued to the boob tube. When the SHTF, the 95% head's will explode and have absolutely no clue on what to do.

  94. Bro,

    Consumers don't care about gold and silver; they would go after crop speculators. It's all kabuki.

  95. Isn't this the type of disinformation the the Nazi Joseph Goebbel's became famous for?

  96. "Our only hope is each other. We must educate and help each other and then we must help as many of our friends, family, neighbors and coworkers as we can. It is up to us to do it ourselves. I'm willing to risk everything trying to help. Are you? Do you know what you believe? What is it that you know to be true?"

    The realization along these lines has been a splinter in my eye/mind for quite a while now. Beyond being glued to silver spot, my "real job" is thoroughly meaningless (or even complicit) in the ongoing slow-mo disintegration of our global social order (or what there was of it to begin with).

    Be careful out there, TF, history is littered with the (mostly unknown) bodies of people who would tell the truth. Will try to do whatever I can to help.

  97. "IT'S THE DOLLAR, STUPID" is the mantra we need to repeat and repeat in their ear.

  98. Good Morning - What an amazing post - it is so odd watching from the wings so to speak, and our country just relies on you so much. I hope you can take it back - but with reason and example, not bloodshed.

    Edward et al - QEII will never end, it will be replaced by something with a different name perhaps -as Pat so clearly stated - the money printing cannot stop because you are spending vastly more than you take in - almost 2 for 1. Unless the US actually defaults on its debts, they must be paid every day - and the US defaulting is a whole different house of cards - and again PM's will rise in value if that happens.

    Eric - yes, those coins were butt ugly.

  99. I tried to tell an old friend the other day that our economy is not improving, like she thinks. She's highly educated w/masters degree, recently married and expecting first child. Although they both have good jobs, they are completely broke: mortgages, student loans, car loans (bmws), zero savings. After doing my best to explain what I know about the Fed, dollar, inflation, etc. in only a few minutes over the phone to someone who only knows that it costs more to fill up her tank, I was told: "well, I don't want to be a paranoid person or be a hoarder...gotta go now". People are too busy to care, very slow to wake up, and of course we all know, by the time they'll be too late.

  100. Monkey smoke,congrats.
    Please make sure you accept no cash premium from Turd for non delivery of the yellow hat.
    That would possibly mean that the hat has been leased or it is part of a fractional reserve ponzi or something like that.
    Insist on delivery and preferably to your place not to Turds vault for safekeeping...;-))

  101. @Bro D.

    I don't think so. Obama calling out the oil speculators is just theater designed to make joe six pack think Obama is looking out for them. Joe six pack could give a sh** about gold and silver; he gives a sh** about gas prices though.

  102. True, Pat, but consumers are gullible to MSM and get stirred up against the villains they create. Not many consumers were customers of Madoff, but a great many aree still mad at him. A lot of consumers don't like the rich, either. It would not be hard to lump PM traders with the villains du joir.

  103. Amen Turd brother, Amen.

    I sent a rather long email to my close acquaintances a few days ago setting out what was going on around them. I got a few replies. A few were interested and thought it was insightful (telling me the vast majority of people still have no clue of what's going on).

    There's also those who can't fathom the possibility of an empire failing and what that entails in terms of the long term devaluation of the USD.

    For those it's handy to have a list of empires that have failed before. I can count at lest 50 failed empires.

    Anyone who questions what's coming really needs to have a look at what happened to Rome starting in 27BC under Octavian's reign as well as Germany leading into 1923.

    Herr Helferrich, the minister of finance for Germany made these comments: "To follow the good councel of stopping the printing of notes would mean-as long as the causes which are upsetting the German exchange continue to operate- refusing to give economic life to the circulating medium necessary for transactions, payments of salaries and wages and so on, it would mean that in a very short time the entire public and above all the Reich, could no longer pay merchants, employees, or workers. In a few weeks, besides the prining of notes, factories, mines, railways and post office, national and local governments, in short, all national and economic life would be stopped."

    The rest is history. In 1921 1 US dollar would buy 276 marks. by 1923 it bought 5 million of them.

    In short, printing money to repay debt solved the problems for Germany temporarilly stimulating production. It was akin to a tsunami waters receeding from the beach. When the wave came back in it utterly destroyed the middle class by throwing millions into unemployement and destroying any wealth of those who had saved in Marks. It created a new class of wealth (those who had speculated by bought metals/hard assets and later selling to buy up land -hmmm..), it made the reform of national budget impossible for years.

    In either case, it was not an event that happened on a specific date, it was a process that unfolded over a period of time. One that I'll continue to tell everyone I know.

  104. CD - my husband, an Electrical Engineer, after having his own company swallowed up by a massive telecommunications firm, said to hell with it almost 2 years ago. His 'job' was so stupid, even though he made seriously big bucks, that I thought he was going to have a heart attack. And one day he basically went in and said 'no more'. We are slowly but surely untangling ourselves from 'the man', and yes, constantly are after brothers and parents and neighbours - talking about the self-interest side of making money through silver, but also just trying to get them past that meaningless news cycle of the dollar is up a penny, oil is down a buck - completely useless information, devoid of context and told with malicious intent. But people are happy - even if they are complaining - they like to complain. Madness.

  105. Obama has done his absolute best to rape the consumer with higher energy prices. His real agenda is too "turn" the US consumer to green alternative energies that do not exist or or not viable yet by making existing energies physco expensive. The plan makes sense in a way but then he has to lie by making someone else the scapegoat for the higher prices when he is actually doing it my undermining drilling permits in the Gulf and strangling the coal industry with clean air bullshit regualtions and on and on.

  106. Trying to grasp/educate myself on the derivatives exposure by JPM.

    Here is a good article highlighting behind the scenes activities. I have to think that silver will be different in the end as supply is running out. Although the power these guys have might lead to a different conclusion.

  107. KWN interview with James Turk ...

    Eric asks James Turk about the mining shares ... worth the listen

  108. Thanks Turd. It is important to educate all as to what is really going on with the intentional destruction of the dollar. BTW, for all you futures/options players trying to snag some fiat, there is an alternative. You can trade the straight pyhsical market, long or short, up to 75% margin available. BE or GET Prepared! Food, gold, silver....... Take care.

  109. Turd: I live in Wisconsin. I went to Madison for three of the union protests, most recent one last Saturday, to counter protest the protestors. Each time I went, I wound up engaging various small groups of protestors in conversations about what they had on their signs or their beefs they had with the governor. Several of them said Wall Street was responsible for these horrific oil prices. I tried to tell them the Federal Reserve was the culprit. They said it was speculators. I said I’m a trader and I don’t care one way or the other if the price of something goes up or down. I just want it moving. Which direction is irrelevant. Their reaction: a blank stare and a return to bitching about the speculators. Based on those conversations, I have come to the sad conclusion there truly is no help for us. There isn’t going to be a cavalry. There isn’t going to be a white knight riding in. The liberals don’t get it and don’t want to. Most of the rest just don’t care. Part 1

  110. Part 2 I have a large group of conservative friends I see on a very regular basis. If I try to discuss any of this I wind up being a buzz killer. The reality of our situation is so dire, no one wants to talk about it. I think that is why Glen Beck is going off of the air. You have to hide sharp instruments if you watch his show but he does get it and he is a messenger of the truth. I have one, let me repeat, one friend who is invested in gold and silver. He actually turned me onto investing in it. He lives out of state but we talk a couple of times a week. He called me yesterday and said he appreciated me being there to talk with because outside of me, he has no one to discuss this Armageddon we are going to experience. I/we should all keep trying. As someone posted earlier, we need to get as many people into the lifeboats as possible. Unfortunately, the only way they will do it at gun point and even then, they’ll be kicking and screaming. Sad ending for the greatest country in the history of the world.

  111. Today is the last day of my temporary, tax season job and tomorrow I'm back on tier 4 of my unemployment ;-( I can use a two week rest, frankly but not 5 months then welfare. The tax place I worked said they really liked me, want to expand into light book keeping for local businesses and if they do, they definitely need someone fluent in Spanish so I might have wrangled my self a job at some point. Say prayers for me.

    To whomever put up the spreadsheet of the NAVs / premiums of some of the PM CEFs thank you. It would be great if you could add the CEF's Silver Bullion Trust but since it has to be calculated (for SVRZF at least) and is not given out by CEF.
    Trading the NAVs has been one of my most successful strategies over the past year or 18 months. Currently I am long CEF and SVRZF. It would be nice if Sprott would issue a shelf filing for Physical Silver and that super high premium contracted way down.

    @ atlee and all FOAGQ thank you for you postings. I'm a relatively new friend and, currently have seller's remorse for lightening 75% of my holdings (which I trade in my IRA and which make up more than half of my IRA holdings) on Thursday at 322.80 and now am sitting on a wad of FRNs over the long weekend hoping that the MOPEsters can talk us into a dip with their forked, silver plated tongues. I'll be watching all night on Sunday and ready to jump back in Monday, Tue, Wed. etc. I hope I can get an return entry at or below my exit but if it looks like an anomalous move up with no correction, I'll just buy in at what I can get it for - I truly believe the trend is our friend for a good long while more on this.

    @ Scott - well that was a fine interview and I'm proud of and impressed by you. In the middle of it, I heard a couple of coins clinking (auditory hallucination?) and thought Eric#1 was there.

    @ Eric #1 well you are just so prolific and have such a great outlook; I love your posts (yours too, Xty you attention whore :p) I ordered 3 Sovereigns from Gainsville and they should be here soon. I doubt if they will satisfy clinking in my big paw but I'll slap them in bezels and wear a couple of them; I prefer the 50 peso and double eagles for hand jobs. Speaking of which stop the porn! You might bankrupt me ;-)

    I've missed so many posts and owe so many answers but mostly I read from my phone and for some reason am unable to use it to post. But I AM reading.

    FOAGQ any suggestions for a re-entry strategy would be appreciated. It is not, for me, an insubstantial amount of cash I need to move back in.

    Ignore the trolls, they are crazier than I am.

    Our Berkey still leaks and the lid still does not close, but a big plus for it is that last night my husband told me that the water from it tastes better than any we can purchase in a store and he is right.

    Survivalists: Consider learning a skill, a knack if you will, that could, conceivably be a life saver: dowsing. I joke you not. is my latest and probably greatest teacher (and I've been studying and dowsing professionally since I was 18 years old. If it moves you give it a look.

    More once the Moon aligns with Mars.


  112. Celente's tone is annoying but his vision is way more right than wrong. Especially the part of migration of populations looking for a living wage.

  113. "Its all those evil speculators fault...etc, etc." Once that group has been witch-hunted and eliminated as a source of trouble what next? Those greedy speculators of precious metals? Not to mention those (also greedy) hoarders of physical gold and silver. Heck, they will need a constant source of scapegoats. Just take a number they will get to your group eventually.
    Have a nice weekend everyone.

  114. guys i am thinking about doing a strange maneuver not sure if anyone has tried it.

    basically i'm going to use my bank line of credit to buy 100-200k of PM and store it in their vault and then pay 6% interest on the loan over period of 2 years. has anyone stored a significant amount of bullion in their banks vault? do u feel comfortable with it?

    i know several will say if it isn't in ur hand it is not urs. but i can't keep storing it in my apt either, makes me uncomfortable to have that much money in my crib, ya know? it seems like storing in australia or switzerland won't make the problem much better (or maybe it will) b/c then it will be even harder to get it

  115. xty right on, we should all take steps to distance ourselves from the system of credit slavery going on. Sadly many will not wake up in time but for those few whom might be reached, there is still time. Spread the word, Turd is the word!

  116. i meant in the bank safety deposit

    also are there better banks for doing this type of thing

  117. @Torx

    Yeah. I remember taking that oath. Still fresh in my mind.

  118. @ sp

    You might try or Bullionvault for allocated storage outside the US jurisjiction as well

  119. @SP
    Probably not a good idea to buy that much on credit. It's awesome that silver is making huge gains but this probably wont last forever and your DCA starts now at 46.6, what if we see a retreat to sub 40's? Can you make enough money from PM's to cover 6% interest?


    Been saying this for a long time now. Finally, the meme is catching on.

    Thanks, Turd!

    - Chumbawamba

  121. Hello Turdites.

    Something does not feel right about this market. 1. It could be the beginnings of a short squeeze or 2. Bull trap.

    1. Silver has gone up pretty much without Blythe and the monkeys stepping on it. Is it because "its when you are in a hole quit digging?" OR Is it short covering? The COT numbers aren't showing this. This leads me to #2.

    2. Bull trap. Let the market rise unabated because we know what the Fed speech results are beforehand then SLAM it down when everyone liquidates because the "hint" QE must wind down.

    As we know its buy/sell the rumor. All it would take is somewhat hawkish comments from the Bernak to rescue the dollar for a little bit resetting commodities lower.

    Any thoughts...

    I day trade with 50:1 leverage and am booking great double digit returns trading less than rational at these astronomical heights. One key is time exposure as part of risk management. Get in and get out. Hit and run to hit it again when the dip occurs.

  122. Brad - I had noticed you were MIA - hope the job takes. I am in the hold everything camp., but I am not averse to a small dip that lets you back in! I didn't want to time the dip - it is not that I do not anticipate a small one. But I think it will be really quick, either brutal or shallow. Sunday night will be interesting. (And after hearing about your jewelry, I thought you were the AW!).

  123. thx murphy

    these sites always make me nervous as well, they know exactly how much of ur stuff they have. i guess then again the bank can figure it out also if they need to

  124. @igiveup2

    I share your sincere frustration and sadness. I had a similar experience during the last election confronting some union types. They couldn't find a sandpile deep enough to bury their heads. Having said that I am a "glass half full" guy and will fight and defend what we we had and hope to recover to the end. I bet you will, too. Have a good Easter and hang in there.

  125. Brad/Jai

    COngrats on those SOvereigns! You're going to like them! Here's a picture of some in your honor!!

  126. @Tim

    You make a good point and I've thought about this. I can buy it with outright cash but I'd rather do it with the banks money. Maybe the smarter thing to do though is to buy it over 3-4 months and dollar cost average, etc. I would rather keep the cash for my business which will return me more than the 6%.

    But you are making me think rethink the plan to just buy it outright. Part of the reason to do it is because I keep holding on longer and longer trying to buy PMs on the dip and I end up simply being underallocated most of the time. If it falls to $40 it won't matter much but if it falls to $25-30 or $1000-$1200 I will hate myself for doing it.

    Anyways besides the plan and amount, do you think it is a bad idea to put it in the bank's safety deposit box?

    As much as I know the dollar is a piece of crap, I'm not a big fan of holding the metals, I've locked them up and hidden them away. I don't like having 10s of Ks sitting in my 1 bdrm apt, at some point I have to get it out of there.

  127. @alex and igiveup

    You both summed up my feelings nicely this week. I sent out an email to a few very clcose friends and family. I just felt a strong desire to at least let them know I tried to warn them. I have had no responses. I wish I had a close friend to talk with about the situation but I am happy to all the turds here. My wife gets it but just does not like talking about it. Watching the value on my pm's rise over the last few months has been bitter sweet. I am worried for my love ones but they either think I am crazy or do not have the assets or income to take action.

  128. Silvercell I agree with you, I'm considering taking some profits this weekend or monday, before the chairman speaks. I was going to take profit at $50 but I may want to take some off the table before then and move them into gold. What are your thoughts?

  129. well I heard about this site from ZH. Looks great!

    I have minted my first ROUND. 0,999 1 troy ounce. And in celebration of Easter Weekend I am offering it for $48 and free shipping.

    You must mention "TFMETALS" in your note to merchant when you buy the rounds. Then I will issue a refund.

    In the meantime if anyone wants to partner up to create a ROUND, feel free to contact me as I am ready to do another one.

  130. ooops...


  131. sp...
    Wow, your really doing some heavy duty planning. Good for you.
    I have no idea about storage at all.
    The only thing I can add is not to max out your line of credit and leave yourself some space.
    Damn, 100-200k, whew!
    The only thing I can add is that if you get caught a little short on cash to repay you can always just sell a little bit to cover yourself if need be.
    Thats obvious and I'm sure you have all the angles covered.
    I don't think you will regeret having lots of physical, however you plan to store it. The bank safety deposit box sounds like a easy and obvious place.
    Your on top of the market situation and the news events all around us, You will know when it's time to start withdrawing the physical by the events leading up to any possible bank closures.
    I can only add that if you go the bank route to maybe open a few safety boxes and spread it out a bit among the bigger ones that are unlikely to close right away.
    Tough call, but a great idea by you.

    word ver....unwired.
    I get some pretty interesting one's

  132. @ SP
    I'm not big on the whole SHTF scenario, but... If you need to liquidate quickly having your PM's close is crucial. Follow me on this for a moment as I've thought about this too, of storing my oz somewhere besides my home. You need to ask yourself the question " If need my oz quickly will I be able to access it?" The problem with the bank is they keep business hours in which the doors will be locked. Not a good idea if you need to make a quick move. That would be my only issue with storing at a bank.

  133. To finish my thought. Having several safety boxes will help with FDIC insurance or something to that effect I think.
    Isn't there a $100k insurance limit on deposit boxes?

  134. Brad,
    My thoughts are with you and your family.
    I live in a small coastal town which is highly seasonal as employment goes.
    Things are unwinding now and lots of folks here are gonna hit some pretty tough going.
    Foreclosures are some of the highest in the country in my area, and another wave is coming.
    They just took away portions of county workers' pensions, and our city's revenue has plummeted (although we have assets and a sizeable kitty), Our budget is about as tight as it can get.
    I'm lucky that I'm semi retired, work primarily seasonally, and generate some income doing odds and ends things.
    I too have attempted to enlighten some others.

    I've shared the silver story with only 1 friend, and mom and I are in this together. She is recently retired, and has no debt.

    To TF and everyone,

    I'm also in the camp of trying to explain to others what's happening, but to little avail.
    One 30 something friend has just got her financial legs under her and is in complete denial. Back before the RE collapse happened, I warned her to watch. I recently gave her the reality of what's going on now. She just blew it off. "We're way" was her response. Others speak with little understanding, simply spouting all of the regular soundbites they hear on MSM.
    I've said before, I'm sad for so many.
    We are prepared and will reach out when possible should SHTF. Peace

  135. I would not keep my silver in a bank vault or safey deposit box. If the SHTF or we start having bank runs and bank holidays, all your valuable shiny will be unaccessable!

  136. The angry rant video at ZH is awesome!

  137. @sp
    I believe in a combination of physical on hand and some in allocated storage outside the US. With entities like Goldmoney you can wire funds to yourself wherever you are. In addition you can even wire metal to others with Goldmoney or Bullionvault accounts I believe. I don't like safe deposit box due to bank holidays (real or forced). You might look into storing at an independent vault company like Wells Fargo, not the bank.
    @ DarkPurple - safe deposit boxes are not insured

  138. @CurbYourMaltusiasm

    Here's SP's Amazon book list for your bedtime reading. SP and I have somewhat different takes on what you need to know, but I agree that the things he mentioned in his post are a must. You will get all of that from the Chris Rowe material.

    Furthermore, I acknowledge SP is far more experienced and knowledgeable than I, so I will defer to that. I saved his list because I thought it would be valuable to me and I intend to read most if not all of this myself. (Thanks, SP!)

  139. DPH, FDIC does not cover safety deposit boxes. Even if they did you'd have to disclose the contents.

  140. I put together an altogether silly piece a while ago on spreading awareness about "the truth". To me, ZH was the rabbit hole that led me to discover people like Turd, Martin Armstrong, Dylan Grice, Antal Fekete, Mike Krieger. A long, long list of names (current and historical) that I would never have even heard about, let alone read.
    The process, in part through the posts themselves, but in larger part through the comments from other readers, has been uniquely rewarding. The same process is happening here (in its, as yet, pure form). I am getting a wealth of knowledge, information, humor, support, intellectual stimulation from people I never met (and unfortunately am unlikely to ever see).

    So this little experiment is focused on Zero Hedge, but could just as well apply to 'Along the Watchtower'. Perhaps one of these days I will come up with an original thought worth sharing, so in preparation for that day, I have started my blog: Real Sim Phony

    BTW, great to see the trickle of once-familiar names on this blog; welcome Chumba

  141. Thanks to both of you for that valuable piece of information. I'm a bit suprised.
    So many smart and well informed people on here.

  142. SP- I would second AC_Doctor on the deposit box; you don't even need a SHTF scenario to render this unavailable to you, what if your bank or its parent institution goes under, then everything is locked away for who knows how long until they arrange for a buyout, account for assets, etc. You don't want that.

    A 1 beedroom apt can be a perfect place to hide PM's. Just get creative with it. Here's a little trick a dope smoking friend in college showed me once. Buy 2 cans frozen concent. orange juice, let them sit out overnight and melt. Open 1 and pour it out, put your 'stash' into the empty can in a sealed bag (or plastic coin tube) then pour melted OJ from the 2nd can into and around it until it is full and totally covered. Put the top back on and superglue the plastic seal tape around it, freeze it, and poof! Hidden. I am sure there are thousands of things like this.

  143. The sheeple don't want to be woken up. They don't want the red pill.
    Those that do want to wake up can educate themselves in 10 minutes on your blog Turd, Zerohedge, silverdoctors, etc.
    Keep up your excellent work, and those who want the truth will find it!

  144. @Pat

    It is said that only 10% of the colonists actively supported the American Revolution. Maybe that's all we need to understand and get engaged today? One can hope.

    At the end of the day, or other side of the storm, there will be no choice other than to reduce government spending AND increase revenues (and likely issue a new currency at some point maybe sooner). Part of the current problem is that the current tax code is not only convoluted and corrupt, bit terribly inefficient as well. There is so much missed revenue, due to "the giveaway's" as some pols like to call them and also to the "driveaway's" - that is driving business out of the country with corporate taxes.

    One possible part of the long term answer?

    (Thanks for the opening) :)

  145. @ Cd
    What started my journey to ZH was a connection from Before that in 2006 I read Crossing The Rubicon by Michael Ruppert. It was he that wrote in 2004 that gold will hit $1700. So much of everything else in his book was accurate I believed him and started investing. If you are not familiar with him he's very interesting as well.

  146. Is a "Bull trap" imminent?

    Silver Cell wrote:
    Something does not feel right about this market. 1. It could be the beginnings of a short squeeze or 2. [A] Bull trap.

    1. Silver has gone up pretty much without Blythe and the monkeys stepping on it. Is it because "[it's] when you are in a hole, quit digging?" OR Is it short covering? The COT [committment of traders] numbers aren't showing this. This leads me to [possibility] #2.

    2. Bull trap. Let the market rise unabated because we [the EE] know what the Fed speech results [Bernanke's speech on the 27th or 28th?] are beforehand, then SLAM it down when everyone liquidates because the "hint" [that] QE must wind down.

    As we know its buy/sell the rumor. All it would take is somewhat hawkish comments from the [Bernanke] to rescue the dollar for a little bit, resetting commodities lower.

    Any thoughts...

    Silver Cell, I think that your hypothesis could be valid. The recent behavior of silver's price is ominous. Indeed, I suspect that silver's price will decline significantly, and perhaps drastically, next week. The dip could be huge.

    I would like to point out, however, that, as I understand matters, the Comex does not release the CoT data for some time, perhaps days. Hence, by the time that we, the public, receive the CoT data, it is already old and not necessarily indicative of the current CoT. At any rate, that is what I have gathered from reading Harvey Organ's blog.

    We, the smart money, all know that QE3 is inevitable. At this point, the Federal cannot possibly stop printing money. There is just no way. The government may think that it could further its interests by deceiving the investing public and assuring the public that QE3 will not come, however, causing the government to defer the beginning of QE3. In other words, there could be a hiatus in QE between the end of QE2 and the beginning of QE3 (perhaps in June?). Or the government could merely pretend to defer the beginning of QE3. Silver's price could decline sharply if the government even pretends to defer the beginning of QE3.

    -- Paul D. Bain

  147. @ silverdoctors -- you are probably right about the vast majority of the population. But there are STILL lots (in absolute, not relative terms) of people potentially receptive to opening their eyes -- without the fortune of having someone close by to help them do it. One it ten? Two in a hundred? With 300M+ in the US and 6.78B worldwide, that still adds up to quite a horde. The mere fact that you maintain your site proves you have not yet given up hope... The real kind, as opposed to the hopium kind.

  148. Thanks, murphy, I know Chris, and am checking out Ruppert now.

  149. man this site is great. i love the fact that i can post such a personal question and get good ideas and answers from everyone quickly. would never ever post something like that (with details) anywhere else (except the bogleheads forum which is great but they don't really get PMs well)

    i'm not really a believer in SHTF scenario either. was born in a 3rd world country and came here as a child, have lived in much tougher environments and don't think u.s. will ever get nearly as bad as india is even today.

    my goal is 2-fold:

    1) protect my fiat wealth
    2) make money via speculation

    it's true that if SHTF i won't be able to access all my PM but how much do we really need for a month, i can probably get by with less than 20k at most in PM and by then that should be worth much more. also if there is SHTF moment, i'm flying out of the country as fast as possible anyways (assuming i can). although to be honest it is hard for me to imagine a time when anything could be worse than most days in india, and it's not so bad there....but who knows

    i am definitely not buying that much PM for safety preparation, but instead b/c i don't want my cash to continue to depreciate.

    after everything has been said, i think i will slowly buy chunks but maybe this catharsis on the net will force me to actually do it and not keep holding off and putting money into my trading account. if i wait till tuesday of course, the siren song of agq will call me....

    thx for info on 100k fdic insurance of safety boxes maybe i can scatter them out

  150. The intelligent ones are waking up. A retired friend just asked me for advice about where to buy physical. He's got all the investments that are usually held. Stocks, bonds, munis, even some big miners (of course the only ones sold by his broker no doubt). Anyway they are starting to wake up.

  151. Thanks for your post, Paul W.

    Not only is the O'Reilly - Beck argument wrong about why oil costs so much, the whole discussion shouldn't even be about the price of oil at all, but what we are going to do to replace oil. The future is clear: more and more expensive oil until we quit using it. The only question then is, how long is that going to take? The quicker the price of oil rises, the quicker we will find a way to replace it.

    We started using oil to power vehicles and industry over 120 years ago and coal over 200 years ago. The entire world is made up of energy. It's the 21st century. We're still reliant on coal and still fighting over oil. What's wrong with this picture???

  152. @cd- your welcome. This is the first place I have ever got involved in posting. Usually only a lurker. Regarding Ruppert: he's gone over the edge for me with his new site I don't want to believe it will come to that as of yet.

  153. Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness ... I still love this phrase ...

    The question remains:

    How would a COMEX rule change affect the Chinese?
    My guess: They would just continue trading... regardless of what Obama says.

    What do you think?

    I don't want to be a troll. I just want to start a discussion.

  154. @CD said...
    twice commented that someone should mint a "Turd Round" with blythe on the reverse

  155. XTY & any other Cdns out there.
    XTRY I saw earlier that you are expecting some coins from Ampex.

    I want to buy a MB of Cdn Silver Maple leafs from
    since right now, for some reason Provident is cheaper that my Cdn supplier
    Funny that for a coin made via RCM, one can purchase it cheaper in USA than in Canada!!

    Anyway, can you tell me wht customs and taxes I am going to get hit with by Cdn gov't?? I live in Ontario if that makes any difference.


  156. murphy -- better to have and not need than need and not have... I agree about the low likelihood, but am acutely aware of the disproportionate impact.

    sp -- the difference between the US and India is that the populace in India KNOWS how to survive in India. I am not sure many US denizens would last very long there. And introducing conditions anywhere close to that would create unforeseen results with the crowd in the US.

  157. Question for anyone- It seems that TPTB are focusing on shorting medium to larg miners who are making tons of money. For example, it seems like they focus on MFN for a couple of months and then let it go. Then they move on to KGC. I am not a chart guy, I like earnings. It looks like they leave alone the smaller ones who are still growing (First Majestic etc.). I know this is stupid but has anyone tracked this in order to possibly forecast the manipulations

  158. Turd, your post was a classic. Truth, well told.

    Lately I’ve been so busy with the garden, chicken coop, boat shakedown and other preparation (more urgently every day), I haven’t had a chance to read all the posts as usual… much less comment. But I had to chime in here.

    It is very frustrating to see shows like O’Reilly chase after the boogey man oil speculators. Has anyone even clued him in about the reality of the mighty dollar? Even sticking with the oil topic in his linear manner, would O’Reilly (the man who always rides the fence and sell coffee mugs and ties), consider, in his tragic myopia and blatant pandering, that our government adds a hefty tax to gasoline and oil? No, he would not. That evidently doesn’t serve his purpose or his “master”.

    Is Glenn Beck the ONLY one on television that sees what is coming and has the fortitude to speak the truth?

    As far as the alphabet media, CNN, most of Fox, MSLSD and others, the sheeple will pile on board with whatever they are fed. Just as they will get on board with “righteous indignation” when Obama, the Dems, Repubs, the media and most everyone else that is under the influence of ignorance and brainwashing will begin to demonize those evil gold and silver speculators and traders.

    When our currency, bond market and treasuries collapse, the politicians, their useful idiot pundits, the entitlement class, the sheeple will join right in the “take back our nations gold from the speculators and hoarders” campaign. The “newly poor” naked short investors will join in the anti-pm ownership prattle.

    Unfortunately, being criticized, ridiculed and marginalized for standing up for the truth of why this country is going over a cliff may be the least of our potential problems. There are many dubious people and powerful institutions that would rob you of your possessions.

  159. Turd,

    That was the best post ever. Seriously. Many of us have been thinking it, but you have said it loud and clear.

    This Easter Sunday, if we're with family, let's all try to talk to them. Give them hope, give them help, and give them hell!

    word ver=lobull as in "The lo of the bull market is behind us. We're ready to see some disorder on the up side!"

  160. re: waffen
    "I have got my Options account funded with 5K.. I took monday off I will be ready to buy my first option. Any advice for a noob? I will have my mother make the same play, she is gonna put up 100K."

    i am proud no one took the bait. this kind of request is just rife with impropriety, and direct investment advice for a self proclaimed "noob" risking $100K of his mother's money is unethical and loaded with liability.

  161. @JoeKa
    Not sure if you're still hanging around, but yes I could have traded/sold today on Chose not to because it was so thin, no idea what a market order would produce for price on execution!

  162. This morning, on another site I read something I’ve seen before that is more troubling than all the dubious ruling class mentioned above:

    "The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry capable of entrusting men like him with the Presidency. It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a man for their president.

    The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails America. Blaming the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president."

    - from a source in the Czech Republic!

    Those of us that do well from our investments should feel a sense of duty to help as many as possible within our means. Additionally, for the sake of our country and future generations, we should consistently write our legislators, media and opinion leaders to shed light about our economy, to whatever degree we’re capable of.

    For the sake of our communities and our country, we need to speak the truth and demand the truth about the problems in America. For the sake of our family’s safety, we need to be discerning… knowing when to speak and when to be silent.

    Between now and the 2012 elections will be the most important time to get active. After that, if we don’t prevail in complete political change of the right kind that leads us back to freedom, only our fellow Compatriots in Truth can create a circle of support. From there, only God can help us.

    Keep the faith. Teach those that need truth. Fight the despots. Don’t argue with drunks, fools and idiots. Live free and unafraid.

  163. Eric #!

    Thank you for thinking of me. The second family emergency is actually worse than we originally thought. It will be a very, very long and difficult journey for my husband and me to deal with everything.

  164. From the FWIW department:

    Maybe this is a non-sequiter, but today's thread brought it to mind. More Kipling:

    IF you can keep your head when all about you
    Are losing theirs and blaming it on you,
    If you can trust yourself when all men doubt you,
    But make allowance for their doubting too;

    If you can wait and not be tired by waiting,
    Or being lied about, don't deal in lies,
    Or being hated, don't give way to hating,
    And yet don't look too good, nor talk too wise:

    If you can dream - and not make dreams your master;
    If you can think - and not make thoughts your aim;
    If you can meet with Triumph and Disaster
    And treat those two impostors just the same;

    If you can bear to hear the truth you've spoken
    Twisted by knaves to make a trap for fools,
    Or watch the things you gave your life to, broken,
    And stoop and build 'em up with worn-out tools:

    If you can make one heap of all your winnings
    And risk it on one turn of pitch-and-toss,
    And lose, and start again at your beginnings
    And never breathe a word about your loss;

    If you can force your heart and nerve and sinew
    To serve your turn long after they are gone,
    And so hold on when there is nothing in you
    Except the Will which says to them: 'Hold on!'

    If you can talk with crowds and keep your virtue,
    ' Or walk with Kings - nor lose the common touch,
    if neither foes nor loving friends can hurt you,

    If all men count with you, but none too much;
    If you can fill the unforgiving minute
    With sixty seconds' worth of distance run,
    Yours is the Earth and everything that's in it,
    And - which is more - you'll be a Man, my son!


    With apologies to all the "Sisters" here, I'm sure old Rudyard couldn't have imagined a world where women had equal opportunities, or he would have written more gender-neutral verse.

  165. @CD:

    you have a good point. i guess what i am thinking is that if SHTF, i think i will be ok. i don't have any clue what manhattan will be like in this scenario, very hard to predict. but i guess i cannot muster enough fear up yet to know what to really do. i also think of what my alternatives are if things got bad & when i think of those it is hard for me to imagine nyc looking worse than delhi, so i think well if it turns into that, i'll just keep going to work and moving along!

  166. Does anyone know where silver is trading right now, and is this chart correct?

    So silver is at $47.68 now? Is there a reason for the dramatic up/down swings? because I don't get it.

  167. Turd, what a fantastic post indeed. The mainstream media uses the Associated Press and Reuters as a basis for all news stories. Reuters is a Rothschild creation from 1800s and the Associated Press has a board of all CEO's of major mainstream media companies (Fox, NBC, CNN, etc..). These people are bought off and/or have other intentions. If you haven't ever read about the Council on Foreign Relations, there is a connection here to the overall pyramid scheme of power (in which all of the people of power belong to).

    Anyways, the point is the news is all controlled and set up by the powers that be. We all just play along in this game and can choose which personality we want to follow. They define the box for you to think in, and that is their game. They give everyone an option, and we feel like we have a free media. However, the real news is the news that is not on television. Open your mind and allow yourself to be vulnerable to reality. Do not be afraid to be wrong, as we learn more from being wrong than right. There are no boundaries and we create everything that we feel. Unlocking your mind from the pre-defined matrix of ideas is the first step towards regaining sanity and feeling alive again. There is a way to know all of this and be at peace with yourself, and that is what I think others as well as myself are striving for. You can see it with all of the emotion within these comments.

    @ Curm

    Thank you for the support. There was indeed silver coins clinking (I think it was Matt). I don't know if he did that on purpose or not, but I will have to ask him. Subliminal messaging is a sneaky thing!

    If you like the band Incubus, I thought their new song was representative of the type of cultural music addressing the reality of what is coming.

    In addition, I believe one of the most popular bands, Link Park, is completely awake to what is coming (from a power standpoint). I don't know how their last album can be construed as anything other than a story of the fall of civilization. I know most of you old timers probably don't listen to this type of music, however, this is what the youth is now subliminally listening to...

    On the other side of the spectrum...
    Britney Spears is "dancing till the world ends" as "this place is about to blow"

    What a world,
    Spread the truth, it is contagious.
    Ron Paul 2012 (or even 2011 is fine with me)

  168. I recently started taking my own advice. In the past, when the conversation allowed it, I was telling people not to be distracted by wedge issues and instead focus that energy to preparing oneself by putting wealth into assets which cannot be counterfeited, printed, repeatedly taxed or nationalized. I had a few friends heed my advice and go in large in the $20s but the great majority think of it as nothing more than a mental exercise. Never taking the step from recognition to action.

    I realized when I was trying to warn people to quit arguing about how best to stop the coming economic tsunami and just run that the true unstoppable tsunami is ignorance. Generations of propaganda simply will not be overcome. I've tried my best to prep my within-arms-reach community but I see now that any further attempt to warn will merely ostracize me.

    Oddly enough, my friend who "got it" in less than 10 minutes into our conversation is a Marine Captain. This guy bleeds red,white and blue and has been to Afghanistan 4 times. I'm not sure if that perspective had something to do with it or not but I realize now that either people get it or they don't.

    I cannot remember exactly what led me to here. I know about 4 years ago I thought, 'I need to get some gold.' Didn't know why, but I was interested in the idea. Silver wasn't even on my radar. Didn't even know such a thing as silver bars existed.

    But life happened and I continued putting capital into my business and also continually wasted many many months on Yahoo message boards like SKF. I recognized the folley of government intervention and just equated that with well, the banks will fail, period. Buy FAZ and relax. LOL! I had no idea how deep the rabbit hole went. I was totally ignorant of what money was or how currency was valued. I think it was a few links to ZH articles which made me see the "silver bitchez" meme. No light went on suddenly but I was fertile ground constantly searching for the truth. After years of hobby reading/ranting about wedge issues, I followed a link to FOA. That was it. Three straight days of reading. Sold my car, threw in some cash and bought bullion within a week.

    I can only hope somewhere somehow something I said to someone in passing, planted a seed of doubt or truth which made them continue searching for their own truth. Who knows what makes the light come on in each of us? I fear some, nay, many people will go thru this coming upheaval and still never understand why.

    Sorry for the stream of thoughts. Wondering if any of you remember when/where the light clicked on for you?

  169. Turd,

    Thanks for sharing your passion in your post. At the end of the day how valuable will your gold and silver be if you live under the rule of a tyrannical government? I read the zero hedge article this morning regarding living in China under an oppressive government system where protesters get death sentences. I'm willing to risk it all because I will not live under such a government. We're heading there quickly and I share your passion with spreading the word. WE DONT HAVE MUCH TIME!

    PS thanks for posting Jefferson's words. We face the same issues as our forefathers did. We all need to reacquaint ourselves with our history.

  170. O'Reilly was saying the exact same thing back in 2008 when oil spiked so I don't think it's Obama calling in a favor. I think O'Reilly is just completely clueless about how the price mechanism in the oil market works.

  171. This comment has been removed by the author.

  172. @Old Navy

    Thanks again, that list is exactly the type of thing I was looking for.

    Enjoy your holiday Sir!

  173. Thanks, Turd. It is about time someone started talking about the constitution, I mean other than Ron Paul. It seems our country has NOT a clue as to OUR RESPONSIBITIES AS CITIZENS of this country. It is just amazing to me how deep a sleep the citizens of this country are actually in. What will it take for them to awaken from the comma like state they are currently living? I have an idea, let's convert everyone's 401k into "Patriot Bonds". US Treasurary bonds for the low introductory price of zero interest!!!! No need to mess with those pesky "transfers", we have already taken care of that for you!!! Your new "Patriot Bonds" are now viewable online with your current 401k administrator!!! How easy is that? Continue on with your daily acitivies, and don't forget to do some shopping in order to help grow the economy!!!

  174. Talking Heads - (Nothing But)Flowers

    Here we stand
    Like an Adam and an Eve
    The Garden of Eden
    Two fools in love
    So beautiful and strong
    The birds in the trees
    Are smiling upon them
    From the age of the dinosaurs
    Cars have run on gasoline
    Where, where have they gone?
    Now, it's nothing but flowers

    There was a factory
    Now there are mountains and rivers
    you got it, you got it

    We caught a rattlesnake
    Now we got something for dinner
    we got it, we got it

    There was a shopping mall
    Now it's all covered with flowers
    you've got it, you've got it

    If this is paradise
    I wish I had a lawnmower
    you've got it, you've got it

    Years ago
    I was an angry young man
    I'd pretend
    That I was a billboard
    Standing tall
    By the side of the road
    I fell in love
    With a beautiful highway
    This used to be real estate
    Now it's only fields and trees
    Where, where is the town
    Now, it's nothing but flowers
    The highways and cars
    Were sacrificed for agriculture
    I thought that we'd start over
    But I guess I was wrong

    Once there were parking lots
    Now it's a peaceful oasis
    you got it, you got it

    This was a Pizza Hut
    Now it's all covered with daisies
    you got it, you got it

    I miss the honky tonks,
    Dairy Queens, and 7-Elevens
    you got it, you got it

    And as things fell apart
    Nobody paid much attention
    you got it, you got it

    I dream of cherry pies,
    Candy bars, and chocolate chip cookies
    you got it, you got it

    We used to microwave
    Now we just eat nuts and berries
    you got it, you got it

    This was a discount store,
    Now it's turned into a cornfield
    you got it, you got it

    Don't leave me stranded here
    I can't get used to this lifestyle

  175. Uh, forgot to give a tip of the cap to Turd of course! Always enjoyed his ZH comments and when i saw he was making this place it was like, "Just shut up. You had me at hello." :-)

    It is such a wonderful service Turd is doing. I think we all realize how tricky it can be to talk money with people. I'm grateful for the community he has created of smart, helpful and insightful folks. It strengthens and increases my knowledge on the matter. And maybe just maybe, it will give me the strength to go into the fray one more time and look for propaganda survivors.

    All the best you crazy bastards.


    Very informative/high production quality video on silver industrial and above ground supply/demand, extreme scarcity by 2019-2020. I thought I knew a lot, but I learned quite a bit in 3 mins. Thier bottom line was silver will increase vs. all PMs, just as platinum was once less than palladium and platinum then skyrocketed past everything.

  177. I have a book called "The Rookie's Guide To Options" by Mark Wolfinger that I'd like to recommend.

    It's an easy read and takes the time to explain the ins and outs of options before actually introducing you to various trades. I'm not a pro yet by any means, but working on it.

    And at the risk of sounding redundant: GO WINGS!!!

  178. DPH,

    Remember too that FDIC doesn't insure against mortality. Good luck being the guy slinging bullion in a bag and walking to your car the day you decide you need it.

    Also, If Wachovia had not been bought on Sunday by Well's Fargo, those branches would have all been unopened Monday, and remained closed until dealt with administratively. Meanwhile, we would have lost one of our biggest banks overnight and would be in chaotic spiral. How long would it have taken to organize visits to each branch with security details just to release safe deposit boxes to customers? And would you want to be there in front of onlookers? And could you prove your bricks were missing even if you wanted to?

    Know your homeowner's/rental insurance company's policies, learn their competitors policies, and keep it in a safe @ home or bury it in multiple locations, I say. If you have serious money, you can diversify your vault storage and hope for the best, but I wouldn't be comfortable without a "survivable" arms-reach portion. Regardless, the neighborhood bank only offers good protection against birth cert's / passports disappearing in a fire @ your residence.

    BTW, they make nifty little hiding cavities that mount in walls that look like electrical outlets. 10oz silver bars and eagles fit great.

  179. SP

    Someone on a thread here some time back suggested checking with your local jeweler - more of the small local types than the big chains - to see if they have a vault with boxes in it. We have two here - one in Mexico and one in USA - who do and both will store PMs for a very nominial fee without the "safe" deposit box issues. You can then spring for insurance from who are specialists in this. In fact the American jeweler already insures his inventory with them. I have a watch that I store myself uninsured but when I used to have money and wore the damn thing, insurance ran about $1600/year. Extrapolating from that, you would pay about $1600 / year for insurance on 100,000.00 in PM and twice that on $200,000.00.

    Our safe deposit box is a corporate one which is handy as it will not be sealed at anyone's death but still we don't use it to hold any of our jewelry or PM just documents.



  180. RE: Waking others / My "red pill" story

    I was on my way home from work in July of '08 and stopped to fill up the tank and the price had jumped to over $4.25 a gallon. There was a "buzz" at the station, and I asked the attendant why the price had jumped so much... He could not answer.

    I didn't do much about it that day, but it stuck in my claw and something just didn't add up. I did not buy the "it was speculators" explanation and began to do some research.

    I stumbled upon Chris Martensen's "Crash Course" videos and from that night my life and my world view have never been the same.

    It was the first time I had ever even heard the term "peak oil", but I "got it" immediately and started reading blogs like Mike Ruppert's "From The Wilderness", James Howard Kunstler's "Clusterfuck Nation", Charles Hugh Smith's "Of Two Minds", Matt Savinar's (now dead) "Life After The Oil Crash", and, of course, ZH.

    My first reaction was to tell everyone I knew about where the world was heading. Surely they too would "get it" and want to hear all about it.

    Boy was I wrong. A few people got it, but the majority thought I was crazy, paranoid, on drugs, or all of the above. They simply would not, and in some cases COULD NOT accept the information.

    That was over 3 years ago and I have since learned to be cautious of when,where, and with whom I discuss such topics.

    These days I focus on building a lifeboat for my family and for those who wish to be shown how to build a lifeboat for themselves. I do not waste time and energy on people who refuse to admit that the ship is sinking.

  181. What do you think of gold jewelry as a hedge against gold confiscation by the government? It is my understanding that countries like India and China, which have restricted private ownership of gold in the past, have gold ownership concentrated in jewelry as opposed to coins or bars.

  182. @code

    good points

    rental insurance doesn't insure gold, silver, at least not traveler's. if any other one does i would get it but haven't properly checked this out.

    ideally this would be the best bet. i haven't seen these electrical outlet mounts u r talking about, i will have to search for them, that sounds like it may work!


    great post as usual

    damn what a slow work day, markets down, the wknd won't arrive fast enough!

  183. jesus, I really need to listen instead of waiting to speak. Just realized Turds entire post was about continuing the fight to spread the truth while I wrote I had quit. The willful ignorance out there is just so exhausting.

    Just re-read the post and I must say I needed to hear it. Timely and well stated. Especially the Declaration of Independence quote. Will reflect on that and my delivery. Thanks Turd.

  184. Clueless about this upcoming week in PMs.

    I'm seeing a lot of posts about a huge correction and others are looking for "disorderly to the upside".

    It won't be boring, that's for sure.

  185. I love these non-market day threads! So rich in wisdom and information!

    PrizeFighter, ScottJ88, Paul W, Larry,

    Good stuff. Eatin' it up! :)

    BTW, my mistake - I see now the discussion in Turd's post was BOR & Dobbs, not Beck. Lou Dobbs always makes me laugh, I don't know why.

    ScottJ88 - Don't be surprised that the Marine Captain was the one who got it. Military officers are smarter than you may have been led to believe. ;) He also, as you said, has the advantage of having seen the real world, so to speak.

    RAILBIRD - "It's the dollar, stupid" I love it!

  186. @ Curb- I did the same thing, read Ruppert's Crossing The Rubicon. Since then they all think I am an end of the world pessimist. I keep it to myself but after two years of telling my nearest and dearest they are starting to come around.

  187. Finnegan...

    I completely agree, it IS that O'Reilly is that clueless and that's not a slap at O'Reilly. I think almost every day (or a couple of times per week), he does that little segment where he has Beck on and two years ago, he'd just make fun of Beck. Starting about a year ago, you could tell that he was finally JUST starting to get some of this stuff, but very much in the infancy phase and much more, "C'mon.... there is NO WAY that's happening here!" But slowly the light bulb is coming on.

    Hannity is the same way and the issue of ripping Obama for talking to Brazil about "We want you to export more oil and we want to be your best customer" shows how many people (like Hannity and O'Reilly/Dobbs) as well as I am sure plenty of conservatives even here DO NOT GET IT... and here is why.

    Because of the dollar ponzi scheme and the fact that the WORLD buys oil in dollars, you bet your ass it is VITAL to US interests that OTHER countries, like Brazil, pump and sell a BUHZILLION barrels of oil to EVERYONE including us.

    We have only two exports that matter right now: the dollar and debt (and I guess inflation) and we MUST keep that going for their to be no collapse. I don't believe Obama in Brazil is just about screwing US oil companies, the Gulf Coast US states or oil workers... it is as much or more about keeping more oil flowing and more US dollars in play... or we are sunk immediately.

    I'm not saying that is what I support, but it is a fact. Like most others here, I think we are due for a "do over" and need it badly.

  188. SP,

    And be sure to check out the related products, which are the everyday, leave in plain sight items converted to house valuables.

  189. @wallace - If you are really concerned with confiscation. I read somewhere that someone manufactures bracelets and necklaces out of coins and bars, therefore making them into jewelry.

  190. On hiding things...

    There are literally HUNDREDS of places in house, dozens in an apartment, to "professionally" hide your metal/stuff that would withstand any scrutiny short of someone literally tearing your place apart.

    Think "dead/hollow places."

    There are some good "how to" books as well:

    1) "The Big Book of Secret Hiding Places" by Jack Luger.
    2)"How To Hide Anything" by Michael Connor
    3) "How To Bury Your Goods" by "Eddie the Wire"

    All VERY useful and helpful.

    Your house and apartment are huge, hollow shells... lots to work with.

  191. California Lawyer - FOA - Friend of Another

    The 'friend' of a London bullion exchange insider ('Another') who started rather detailed and (to some) shocking revelations as to the nature, purpose and mechanism of controlling precious metals, but mainly Gold. You can still find FOA commentary archived in various places on the web.

    FOFOA is 'Friend of FOA', and his blog is still active to this day.

  192. Thanks for sharing that, Code

    I also agree with your earlier comments about safe deposit boxes, the main problem with them being that they are inside banks! I think a storage unit might inspire more confidence from moi.

    IRT the everyday items, hide in plain sight idea, someone else on this board suggested paint cans in your garage/basement. I thought that idea had a lot of appeal.